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CRJ not following the glide slope


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Just to chime in, I feel relieved that the dev team has responded that it will continue to be worked on.

 

GS autopilot and FMS lockups are in my opinion two important bug fixes that rank high on my list of need to fix. Understand that MSFS is new and it has it's limitations. 

 

 

Thanks Aerosoft dev team!

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I had the same ILS  problems at KMDW and KORD, coupled to LOC perfectly, aligned to runway, indicated on GS and began descent, then increased rate of descent, continued below GS, followed LOC, at 2 DME would have crashed short of runway if I hadn't taken over. Shot 5 approaches, always the same results. I have the latest version.

 

 

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Per some recommendations from others I have been keeping the approach speed at 160 with 45d flaps and the aircraft 

has been doing better on following the GS but still starts to drop when I  reduce speed at final and take manual control.
Hope it gets fixed soon. I fly the Working Title Citation and it does the VNAV and ILS perfectly.

 

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I have had some successful landings using VNAV to descend all the way through to short final.  It turns to green VGP mode for vertical guidance and I get green LOC1 annunciated in the PFD for lateral guidance.  Seems to be ok workaround for me until the GS issue is resolved....

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With VNAV set to "Coupled" I hardly ever get the AP to arm and intercept GS - it almost alwas sets VGP mode.

With VNAV set to Advisory mode (unchecked "VNAV Coupled") GS both armed and engaged.

 

The GS was perfectly held until reaching MDA where I disengaged the AP.

With both Gear down and Flaps at 45, speed was kept at Vref+5 knots.

 

I´m not sure, but I think the bug with not following the GS, comes down to whether "VNAV Coupled" is enabled or not.

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Let me submit this video as the definite proof that it's not an user operator issue but the aircraft itself. I was doing this tutorial to teach people how to do ILS approach properly in this aircraft. Not only did the AP skip a waypoint, I had to bring the plane back into the CRS. It never captured the ILS even if I had the proper configuration. 

 

 

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14 minutes ago, Claude Desrosiers said:

Let me submit this video as the definite proof that it's not an user operator issue but the aircraft itself. I was doing this tutorial to teach people how to do ILS approach properly in this aircraft. Not only did the AP skip a waypoint, I had to bring the plane back into the CRS. It never captured the ILS even if I had the proper configuration. 

 

With all due respect, I don't think you should be making tutorials on this aircraft. There are so many things wrong in this video. If you try to intercept the ILS from at a 160 degree angle, basically flying the opposite direction, it will not work in the real plane either (though it seems the blue needle never registered going through the localizer, that might be addon related). Not surprised LNAV lost the plot here. Then you go into ROLL mode and APPR armed and expect it to start turning quite a bit before you are near the localizer, that will not work either. Flying the approach at 20 knots below Vref is also generally frowned upon to put it mildly, but also shows the lack of realistic low speed cues on the speed tape.

 

Just saying, there is so much going wrong here it is hard to know what is user error and what is not.

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1 minute ago, CRJay said:

 

With all due respect, I don't think you should be making tutorials on this aircraft. There are so many things wrong in this video. If you try to intercept the ILS from at a 160 degree angle, basically flying the opposite direction, it will not work in the real plane either (though it seems the blue needle never registered going through the localizer, that might be addon related). Not surprised LNAV lost the plot here. Then you go into ROLL mode and APPR armed and expect it to start turning quite a bit before you are near the localizer, that will not work either. Flying the approach at 20 knots below Vref is also generally frowned upon to put it mildly, but also shows the lack of realistic low speed cues on the speed tape.

 

Just saying, there is so much going wrong here it is hard to know what is user error and what is not.

 

With all due respect. VREF does not affect whether my aircraft can capture an glideslope or not.   As far as the LNAV losing the plot is that this approach is supposed to an arc approach to PRIYES but I don't believe the CRJ support this.  You can come here and point fingers at me, It doesn't explain how the CRJ did not capture the localizer even if I was in LOC1 and I had the right frequency and course setup. I am pretty sure that all the other error has no effect on that. 

 

Can I give you a bit of advice CRJay, I am sure you are a nice guy and you meant well but at a lot of flight simmer are just exactly like me. One of the biggest issue I come across in the flight sim community is people like you looking down at people like me. Of all the aircraft in MSFS, P3D or XP11 that I own.  I never had issue capturing a glideslope except the CRJ. Even the Majestic Dash8 which has a very similar way of capturing glideslope, you go to Set the CRS and Frequency, Go to LOC1 , capture the glideslope and control the descent with throttle.  I am not an expert. This video was not meant for expert. It was meant for people who just get started in flight sim. I picked a FP that was done by simbrief. JAMMIE5 was the approach for this runway.  Even the 747-8, an Asobo default aircraft capture the glideslope every single time.  So Aerosoft needs to stop blaming Asobo about the ILS capture abilities of the CRJ and fix it already. Even their Aerosoft A320 Pro works perfectly in P3D. So they know how make an aircraft that can do this. I am tired of hearing the BS of blaming user. Fix the darn aircraft.

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11 minutes ago, Claude Desrosiers said:

 

With all due respect. VREF does not affect whether my aircraft can capture an glideslope or not.   As far as the LNAV losing the plot is that this approach is supposed to an arc approach to PRIYES but I don't believe the CRJ support this.  You can come here and point fingers at me, It doesn't explain how the CRJ did not capture the localizer even if I was in LOC1 and I had the right frequency and course setup. I am pretty sure that all the other error has no effect on that. 

 

When you get to that point on the speed/drag curve you have an autopilot trying to balance raising the pitch to stay in the air without stalling and then trying to lower the pitch again to catch the glide. You could see it was starting to descend (VSI was going to the appropriate rate for your groundspeed). It might have gotten back on the glide if you gave it a bit more time. So again, I can't tell if the behaviour in this video is because of trying to fly the approach at too low speed or an issue with the plane. Definitive proof it is not.

 

The issue being discussed in this topic has been for some time now, losing the glideslope at ~1000ft AGL. That seems to be the main problem after the update.

 

And flightsim noob or pro... If you are going to try to teach others, I suggest you first learn how to do it properly yourself. But that is just an opinion, no personal offence intended. 

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1 minute ago, CRJay said:

 

When you get to that point on the speed/drag curve you have an autopilot trying to balance raising the pitch to stay in the air without stalling and then trying to lower the pitch again to catch the glide. You could see it was starting to descend (VSI was going to the appropriate rate for your groundspeed). It might have gotten back on the glide if you gave it a bit more time. So again, I can't tell if the behaviour in this video is because of trying to fly the approach at too low speed or an issue with the plane. Definitive proof it is not.

 

The issue being discussed in this topic has been for some time now, losing the glideslope at ~1000ft AGL. That seems to be the main problem after the update.

 

And flightsim noob or pro... If you are going to try to teach others, I suggest you first learn how to do it properly yourself. But that is just an opinion, no personal offence intended. 

 

It's just so happen I was recording that day. If you think the only issue with the CRJ Glideslope is at ~1000ft AGL, than you haven't flown the CRJ enough. But yes, I will concede to you that my speed was a bit slow and it might of starting to descend but since many of us have been burn with the aircraft not doing what it should, you get a little bit quick on the trigger.  I don't mind going back and doing this again to prove a point. The CRJ does have issue capturing properly the G/S. I'm not the one only reporting it. This has become a meme in the community. It's like russian roulette. Maybe it will work, maybe it won't. I've done plenty of approach at VREF only to see the CRJ just ignore the G/S all together.  

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1 hour ago, vallson luciano said:

im not sure if what i did was a coincidence,but it worked, first on efb change fligth director to single and then in mcdu insert manually  ils frenquecy on nav1 and nav2, then diseble vnv adversory, 

but on second landing  the airplane did not follow down the glide  , it need to be fixed soon as possible 

 

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Hi all, same issue here.  

 

I'm not rated in the CRJ, but am in B737, so would hope I understand how to properly fly an ILS.  Despite the aircraft no longer diving to the ground after G/S interception after this last patch, it still flies considerably below the G/S.  If I don't disconnect the A/P and hand fly it, it will inevitably drive me to the ground.  

 

I have tried all the recommended "fixes" on this thread to no avail.  

 

Furthermore, I said, well, I'll just fly it the traditional way using V/S via the vertical speed contingency on the approach chart, but that (to my surprise) also didn't work.  I was descending at 2,000FPM when I tried changing the V/S to 800FPM, but the aircraft kept descending at 2,000FPM.  I even tried recycling the V/S switch just in case, but no luck.  

 

Aerosoft, please look into this.  The number of users reporting this issue exceeds the possibility of it simply being a "user error" or an "Asobo bug" - Especially now that you've written your own G/S hold function.  

 

Thank you.  

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I have the same issue. ILS is a lottery. It may or it may not work. If it does then it does not work correctly. Flown about twenty five flights to check (I won't bore you with the videos). I think by now we can discount user incompetence. Looking forward to an update to fix this, please.

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4 hours ago, panda180 said:

The number of users reporting this issue exceeds the possibility of it simply being a "user error" or an "Asobo bug

Wait, there are "too many reports" so it must be an Aerosoft bug and not an Asobo bug? I'd love to know how the number of reports determines that, it just sounds weird.  

 

 

It seems you think Aerosoft is lying about it for some reason. I'd love to know the payoff for them to do so. Maybe, even though Aerosoft and Asobo have a partnership for this aircraft you have info from Asobo saying "no, our AP API works perfectly, its Aerosoft's fault". No? Weird, especially when Asobo talk about fixing their AP issues over the long term.  

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6 hours ago, Thx1137 said:

Wait, there are "too many reports" so it must be an Aerosoft bug and not an Asobo bug? I'd love to know how the number of reports determines that, it just sounds weird.  

 

 

It seems you think Aerosoft is lying about it for some reason. I'd love to know the payoff for them to do so. Maybe, even though Aerosoft and Asobo have a partnership for this aircraft you have info from Asobo saying "no, our AP API works perfectly, its Aerosoft's fault". No? Weird, especially when Asobo talk about fixing their AP issues over the long term.  

 

The flight sim community are not idiots either. I may not be an CRJ expert but I did fly at lot of different aircraft since the FSX days. I think by now I understand how a G/S is supposed to work.  The CRJ just doesn't work the way it supposed to. That's just a fact. Aerosoft needs to swallow their pride and fix whatever is causing this. There is no need for this bickering of "user error". If I bring an aircraft at the right flight level , at the right angle, on LOC1 using the right NAV1 frequency, That i am on APPR, the plane should follow the G/S. That's not rocket science. Even the default Asobo aircraft does this better than the CRJ. This idea that it's Asobo's fault is ridiculous. I flew the 747-8 in KFJFK, I catch the G/S every single time.  I expect the CRJ to be able to do the same.

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7 hours ago, Thx1137 said:

Wait, there are "too many reports" so it must be an Aerosoft bug and not an Asobo bug? I'd love to know how the number of reports determines that, it just sounds weird.  

 

 

It seems you think Aerosoft is lying about it for some reason. I'd love to know the payoff for them to do so. Maybe, even though Aerosoft and Asobo have a partnership for this aircraft you have info from Asobo saying "no, our AP API works perfectly, its Aerosoft's fault". No? Weird, especially when Asobo talk about fixing their AP issues over the long

 

Precisely as Claude said. This forum post should not be about debating back and forth about the validity of a bug nor about pointing fingers. Instead, it is about identifying the issue and finding a solution to it. 

 

I neither have the time nor interest to sit here and play ping pong with you as a result of your inability to understand my previous post. 

 

The facts are:

 

1. The CRJ is not properly nor consistently capturing glideslopes. 

 

2. A slew of users have reported the issue. Many of them have reported being able to properly do so in other aircraft. I can confirm this, too. Meaning, it is possible and not entirely an Asobo issue, nor the users inability to fly an ILS properly. 

 

3. Aerosoft should investigate the matter and hopefully find a solution soon. 

 

Aerosoft, again, please look into this matter. At the very least, please acknowledge our feedback. 

 

 

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Not to get into a thing... yes multiple reports about issues and I do believe that they have said they are looking into it...

 

Now as for how this plane interacts with the sim vs the Default planes....  Well that is going to be different in it's nature and I am sure that based on other developers comments and very thorough explanations (also you will find them giving very very specific requests on the MSFS posts with intricate solution recommendations) on the state of the SDK and certain interactions that make some very difficult to deal with..

 

Jean Luc has a great read concerning it over here

 

https://www.avsim.com/forums/topic/596765-gtn650750-updates/page/4/?tab=comments#comment-4495116

 

Don't read this as a suggestion that there is "No Bug" in the CRJ AP ...  Just that maybe it is harder for them with MSFS vs P3D/FSX and working to resolve these kinds of things...

 

I am awaiting all of my favorite Developers products (especially RealityXP GTN) and when a bunch of them say they have some limitations or SDK requirements....  I tend to also see that as a lot of reports that maybe it's not cut and dry..

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Aerosoft worked with Asobo on the SDK. They helped develop it. So it's the SDK is not adequate, they need to use their influence as a significant 3rd party developer and get the jobs done.  Not only will it benefits their CRJ but all the other aircraft they are working on.  The "user error" pointing finger game needs to stop.  The answer we are looking for is " We are currently working with Asobo toward a fix". That's it. 

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