Soooo......any news?

[mikkel 63]

Anything new here, except the usual harassment of the developer?

I keep my hopes high.

[FernandoPosada 8]

Sooo….. any news?!

[Brand0n 28]

On 3/5/2024 at 5:49 AM, FernandoPosada said:

Sooo….. any news?!

Check in again next year . I’m sure by then it will be soon.

[mikkel 63]

Sim-season is almost over, spring is technically here, and once the weather is alright in the north, the FS-computer will be disconnected until next winter. No CRJ before MSFS 2024 for me?

[Lars K. Rønes 38]

At this point, I think the best that would happen is that a respectable developer who actually cares about the product and the customers who buys it will develop a new CRJ which will leave this Aerosoft one in the dust. I will definitely not buy anything Aerosoft again, unless the current attitude towards supporting products change, as well as proper communication towards customers. Nobody wants to listen to "We're working on it, trust us, it will come when its done" for a year or more. 

[mikkel 63]

1 hour ago, Lars K. Rønes said:

At this point, I think the best that would happen is that a respectable developer who actually cares about the product and the customers who buys it will develop a new CRJ which will leave this Aerosoft one in the dust. I will definitely not buy anything Aerosoft again, unless the current attitude towards supporting products change, as well as proper communication towards customers. Nobody wants to listen to "We're working on it, trust us, it will come when its done" for a year or more. 

I really wish you could delete this rather insulting and mostly nonsensical post.

[Lars K. Rønes 38]

On 3/15/2024 at 4:43 PM, mikkel said:

I really wish you could delete this rather insulting and mostly nonsensical post.

How is it nonsensical? This is a paid product, and it has been left to rot for pretty much 2 years, while they're busy working on other stuff. And did we forget about the Twin Otter? I have bought products from many MSFS developers, and there are 2 developers who has proven to not really care much about keeping the product updated: Wing42 with the Boeing 247D, literally just disappeared. And then Aerosoft who just moved on and keep promising updates in all eternity. I think we'll probably get MSFS2024 before an update drops for CRJ. Maybe even the PMDG777 and PMDG737MAX, which is just plain ridiculous. So no, my post is not nonsensical, I wouldn't post that for no reason, but it is quite clear that Aerosoft has no interest in the CRJ. Lets be real here, we're talking about finishing an UPDATE fixing bugs, not redeveloping a complete and new complex airplane...... It is inexcusable. 

[mikkel 63]

On 3/15/2024 at 7:54 AM, Lars K. Rønes said:

At this point, I think the best that would happen is that a respectable developer who actually cares about the product and the customers who buys it will develop a new CRJ which will leave this Aerosoft one in the dust.

 

You wonder what's nonsensical? That bullshit you wrote right there. Some buying the CRJ, but for developing a new one, etc... ? Makes no sense. And adding to injury, do you have any insight into how well documented the code for the project is? No.

And you know _this_ is not true:

 

7 hours ago, Lars K. Rønes said:

but it is quite clear that Aerosoft has no interest in the CRJ. Lets be real here, we're talking about finishing an UPDATE fixing bugs, not redeveloping a complete and new complex airplane...... It is inexcusable. 

And since you know the written language to some extent, you are also able to read that a quite large update is in the works.

Sorry, but people should stop writing like teenagers when they are done with their teens, preferably long before.

But we can agree on that an update to fix open issues are long overdue...

[Lars K. Rønes 38]

25 minutes ago, mikkel said:

 

You wonder what's nonsensical? That bullshit you wrote right there. Some buying the CRJ, but for developing a new one, etc... ? Makes no sense. And adding to injury, do you have any insight into how well documented the code for the project is? No.

And you know _this_ is not true:

 

And since you know the written language to some extent, you are also able to read that a quite large update is in the works.

Sorry, but people should stop writing like teenagers when they are done with their teens, preferably long before.

But we can agree on that an update to fix open issues are long overdue...

Well, at this point, with the time it has taken to make one single "large" update, PMDG has pretty much finished the entire B777..... Fenix was able to basically revamp the A320 with extremely complex simulation. That has got to be one huge update. lol. Sorry, but the only thing that is nonsensical here is the time it has taken with no updates whatsoever, and it is still seemingly just "at some arbitrary point in the future" with not a single shred of information about what may be included in that update..... Just.... "Trust us, we're working on it". 

[FlyingHero 8]

I came into simming a year ago so all the waiting is kind of new to me. But being a rookie also gives me a bit of an objective view. What I know is that people at my VA and people I do group flights with all say the same. "The CRJ a pretty great aircraft, just too bad it's been abandoned by the developer."

 

That's a lot of people saying the same thing. A lot of people with the same impression. None of them believe there will be an update coming.

 

I also experienced the HH ATR first-hand, complete with bugs that still haven't been fixed (like frequently dropping below the glidescope, VNAV Path not being found and RNP approaches pointing halfway down the runway instead of the threshold). People have actually used the line "It's an HH product" as if I should know what that means and why it is negative.

 

I also have experienced just how uncommunicative AS tends to be and people telling me to "get used to it" whenever I buy an AS product. And I've seen the Twin Otter disappear even though people keep telling me it's a good airplane.

 

So sure, I can only guess how much work goes into it. Probably a lot more than we think. Being in IT I have an idea.

 

But good communication to shape customer impression is very important. I would buy the CRJ because it is the only option and people tell me it is perfectly flyable (which by the way is one thing which annoys me about many users, they believe that if the aircraft doesn't do full LNAV, VNAV and Autoland it is unflyable, not actually wanting to think for themselves and do a bit of actual piloting). But, I don't feel confident. And that's just sad, especially if this really is a great product (the FSS E-Jets are actually pretty good but nobody on YT will touch them after that messy introduction).

[Mathijs Kok 135]

17 hours ago, FlyingHero said:

That's a lot of people saying the same thing. A lot of people with the same impression. None of them believe there will be an update coming.

 

Tell them they are wrong; it is being worked on at this moment. I know, I saw it.

[FlyingHero 8]

And I know somebody who claims to have seen a UFO. Oddly enough most people don't seem to believe him. I don't even know if I believe him, even though I personally know him.

 

The point I was trying to make is that structured communication goes a long way in managing customer expectations. I really don't like marketing, but it does make a few good points. "It's done when it's done" only goes so far. And as annoying as it is to deal with people when all you want to do is get back to work, unfortunately it's part of the process. Just today I spent 8 hours explaining to people what my team and I planned on developing for the next quarter. I could almost feel my brain cells dying. But in the end they were happy and confident I could do as I claimed. And now I'll barely hear them for the next 3 months.

[amahran 608]

2 hours ago, Mathijs Kok said:

 

Tell them they are wrong; it is being worked on at this moment. I know, I saw it.

Mathijs, you can only say that so many times before it’s no longer credible…

[mspencer 2]

13 hours ago, amahran said:

Mathijs, you can only say that so many times before it’s no longer credible…

He has no reason to cover for them, doesn't work for Aerosoft anymore, and wasn't brought up in this thread as he left there 8 months ago. There's zero reason to start questioning his credibility, I would take it at his word that it's underway, but I think the only people who have a timeline are Hans and the CRJ's new PM.

[Mathijs Kok 135]

19 hours ago, amahran said:

Mathijs, you can only say that so many times before it’s no longer credible…

 

So basically you say I am lying. That's fine, not the first time. Just promise to apologize when the update is released, okay?

 

I fully understand why customers are not happy about the fact the update is not yet available, nobody, including Hans, is; I simply do not understand why this can't be discussed as adults. Does it pleasure people to jump on an issue like this, even though everything that could be said has been said? Do people honestly think venting here will bring the update closer?

 

Mathijs

[FlyingHero 8]

I see mostly polite responses, wouldn't call that venting as much as expressing justified frustration. And if people never let their voices be heard, how would anything ever change? How would others ever know change was required?

 

Anyways, I've said my bit. It is disappointing there isn't more transparency concerning the status of that update or that the update isn't done in smaller chunks. In the Age of Agile neither should be that hard to accomplish.

 

The CRJ is still very much flyable and enjoyable, update or not. I suppose we have no choice but to trust in strangers to continue maintaining it.

 

Thank you for taking the time to respond, that goes to all of you.

[FrankGehry 28]

4 hours ago, Mathijs Kok said:

 

So basically you say I am lying. That's fine, not the first time. Just promise to apologize when the update is released, okay?

 

I fully understand why customers are not happy about the fact the update is not yet available, nobody, including Hans, is; I simply do not understand why this can't be discussed as adults. Does it pleasure people to jump on an issue like this, even though everything that could be said has been said? Do people honestly think venting here will bring the update closer?

 

Mathijs

Hi Mathijs,

 

I don't think anyone is hoping to magically make the update come quicker. Instead, what's being discussed is the possibility of some previews to drum up some excitement, even if that comes knowing an update isn't right around the corner. I don't like the way many are talking about Aerosoft, Hans, and this product, but I don't find it unreasonable to ask for a preview of the update-to-come. If the answer is no, then the answer is no.

 

I think what's happening is that due to the lack of transparency, some users are jumping to the conclusion that the update either 1) isn't that far along at all or 2) isn't happening at all. I don't believe either for the record. Some quick previews would help squash these kinds of comments.

 

FG

[amahran 608]

This conversation does hint towards the fact that an update doesn’t matter. The aircraft is flyable as is (albeit barely with so many marked deficiencies that make for a subpar experience). Aerosoft commits to not explaining the progress, which either implies that they either:

1) They don’t know that this looks negative to their A330 and future portfolios, and reduces the likelihood of take up for the A330 (I’m convinced no one is that stupid)

2) They know, and they don’t care, which implies the existence of a more primary customer than the market. This matches the theory that there’s an NDA that this CRJ is under, hence why there’s no explanation or clarification for months.

 

I said this about the Twin Otter, and I’m gonna say it for the CRJ: either this is under the MSFS2024 Developer’s NDA (in which case, the long radio silence makes sense), or the product has been fully abandoned. I can’t think of any other explanation that makes sense from a business perspective.

 

So I’ll say: from my perspective as a consumer, there are three ways this goes:

1) This CRJ doesn’t get updated at all. I’m left with a sour taste in my mouth and avoid Aerosoft products

2) The CRJ gets updated eventually, but has nothing to do with MSFS2024. If the update isn’t substantial in nature, I’m left with a sour taste in my mouth which will take a long while to digest

3) The CRJ gets updated eventually, and is revealed to have been held back to align with MSFS2024. Once again, sour taste in my mouth that I would direct at both Aerosoft and Microsoft simultaneously for writing NDAs that genuinely leave consumers in the dark.

[Thijs010 49]

Well written!

[Mathijs Kok 135]

13 hours ago, amahran said:

This conversation does hint towards the fact that an update doesn’t matter. The aircraft is flyable as is (albeit barely with so many marked deficiencies that make for a subpar experience). Aerosoft commits to not explaining the progress, which either implies that they either:

 

 

I do not see why Aerosoft should 'explain the process.' Hans has made a clear statement, and there is simply not much to add to that statement until the update is available. I am sure when the update (better call it a new version as it is a substantial change) is close to release; there will be previews, feature lists, etc. Just as is always done at Aerosoft. Now, you don't believe there will be an update, but I know for a fact there will be one. I am in the Discord group about it, you are not. Yet you accuse me of not telling the truth.

 

I will remove myself from this topic.

 

[FlyingHero 8]

EDIT: I had a reply to a since-removed post here. Don't see a way to delete my own post so I'll do it this way.

[Sven Telljohann 500]

Gentlemen, I would like to ask you to ensure that we treat each other peacefully here. 

 

Please adhere to the forum rules.

 

I don't want to have to repeat myself there. 

 

We cordially invite you to have a friendly conversation here.
You are also welcome to criticize us, but this should not be offensive or insult other forum users.

[SIMIOVOLADOR 1]

On 10/31/2023 at 12:42 PM, Hans Hartmann said:

that it will be a major one, that it will include the much awaited LNAV/VNAV fixes as well as Simbrief, Navigraph Charts, an updated model with a detailed cabin and more.

 

 

 

On 3/21/2024 at 9:18 AM, Mathijs Kok said:

In the update (better call it a new version as it is a substantial change)

 

Hello there, 

 

I read between the lines in the middle of the discussion and my humble opinion is that it looks like the "remastered" CRJ is coming for the new MSFS...

 

On 3/20/2024 at 7:58 AM, Mathijs Kok said:

I fully understand why customers are not happy about the fact the update is not yet available, nobody, including Hans, 

 

It would seem that Hans is also not happy that the "update" didn't come out. Something similar to what happened with the last update of the ATR?...

[mikkel 63]

[jstnj 108]

On 3/21/2024 at 9:18 AM, Mathijs Kok said:

 

I do not see why Aerosoft should 'explain the process.'

 

Yes, that was very apparent during your tenure.

Dont get me wrong...I dont doubt your dedication to your craft in general, we just have different understandings of how things can get done in software development. 

As someone working in software development for a decade, its clear Aerosoft simply does not understand this truth:

Customer communication, expectation handling, and transparency are 50% of a product and what gets delivered is the other 50.

Maybe it's the model for contracting out dev work that leads Aerosoft down this road? I can't say. Relying on one EXTERNAL principal developer and only having a skeleton crew of people who can write code in house certainly seems like a nightmare. 

Seems like a death by many cuts resulting in a slow erosion of Aerosoft's status in the flightsim ecosystem.