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Navigraph navdata transition multi selection


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Hi,

 

after updating the navdata with navigraph there are for some approaches several entries for the same transition.

 

The problem is, that if I select one entry of the transition, that is listed multiple times, all entries are selected and the flight plan is messed up. 

 

Im pretty sure it’s a bug, but it would be nice to see if anybody else can confirm it. 
 

 

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5 hours ago, Ferkelchen said:

Hi,

 

after updating the navdata with navigraph there are for some approaches several entries for the same transition.

 

The problem is, that if I select one entry of the transition, that is listed multiple times, all entries are selected and the flight plan is messed up. 

 

Im pretty sure it’s a bug, but it would be nice to see if anybody else can confirm it. 
 

 

Which specific approach and transition? I will check.

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Thank you for checking.

It was the "ILS RWY 06" approach with "DIK" transition at "ELLX" Luxembourg. I will append a Screenshot.

I had the same behaviour at other airports too, but as I flew so much the last days, I only remember ELLX. I will have a look into my Simbrief history. When I find more examples, I will add the info here.

 

 

Transitions.jpg

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For EHRD you have an approach with ROT transition for CAT A & B aircraft and one for CAT C&D aircraft. Basically the same approach but with a bit wider (or narrower) turn towards final. Same applicable to ELLX.

 

For now you can only see the difference between the two on your map, if you are lucky. In the naming in the FMC it is not very clear indeed. Do not know if it’s also in real life?

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Thanks Thijs010 for your explanation.

 

I thought of something like that being the reason for the same transition showing up more than once. 


But the big problem is that it’s not possible to select just one of the entries with the same name. There are always all of the transitions with the same name selected. You can see it on the screenshots I appended. 

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Yes so hopefully Navigraph wil take care of the issue. Or, that’s why I asked, if it’s also like this in real life: how do the CRJ pilots cope with this?

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I really hope someone can help and answer your question.

It would be nice too, to see if the multi selection only happens to me or if anyone can confirm this behavior. 
 

In my opinion, there are now four possible scenarios:

 

1. Navigraph issue:

There are never multiple transitions with the same name in the navdata and therefor the multi selection isn’t a factor anymore, because it just can’t happen. 

 

2. CRJ issue:

It’s correct that there are transitions with the same name and you should be able to select just one of them. 

 

3. Navigraph & CRJ issue

There are usually no transitions with the same name, but the CRJ should be able to select just one anyways. 

 

4. No issue at all:

There are transitions with the same name and if you select one, the CRJ selects all of them at once and you have to manipulate the flight plan. 

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This problem appears to be specific to the Navigraph database for the CRJ.
 

Using the supplied Aerosoft NavDataPro database, at ELLX ILS06, it shows discrete transitions based on the DIK VOR marked DIK, DIK 2D and DIK 2Q, and each can be selected individually without selecting them all at once.

 

I have verified that the transitions at LSZH ILS34 based off of GIPLOL and RIKAX are correctly shown in the default Aerosoft database but not in Navigraph.

 

Although we support the use of Navigraph as an alternative to the Aerosoft database, any errors like this are something that only Navigraph can correct, and would best be addressed to them on their own support forum.

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Update: I did post at Navigraph about the problems at ELLX and LSZH with multiple transitions all identified the same way. Richard and his team are usually quite responsive to issues like this, so hopefully a solution can be found.

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Update to the update: Richard at Navigraph has already identified the problem, and a revised version of the Navigraph CRJ database will be forthcoming in a few days that will fix these problems.

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Wow, thank you very much JRBarett for checking, explaining, getting in contact with Navigraph and solving the issue 👍
 

I think this topic can be closed.

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6 minutes ago, Ferkelchen said:

Wow, thank you very much JRBarett for checking, explaining, getting in contact with Navigraph and solving the issue 👍
 

I think this topic can be closed.

I’ll leave it open until we can verify that the new version is working properly.

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I hope Navigraph is solving this in general. Or do we need to report this per airport? Like EHRD that was mentioned above as one of the arrivals that look similar in name... 

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1 hour ago, Thijs010 said:

I hope Navigraph is solving this in general. Or do we need to report this per airport? Like EHRD that was mentioned above as one of the arrivals that look similar in name... 

No, apparently the underlying problem has a common root cause at all airports where there are multiple variations of a transition off of one initial waypoint.

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