Timmy21790 2 Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Hey all Was wondering if you can shed any lights on tips in to plan a flight using PFPX At the moment, I been trying to plan simple flight, for an example LS394 ZRH-MAN flight After using the quick find route, and validate it and it comes back some with errors saying cant use this, cant use that so I used the advanced options, put in the segments I cant use in the usual place and it finds another, but it wont validate and comes back with even more errors.... and it repeats, been using the RAD to find out why Its seems the time spent in using the software to plan a nice flight is enough to throw a pilot off to say, oh I cant be bothered any more and not fly Many thanks for any support to help me find an easier way to use this software Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deputy Sheriffs mopperle 4162 Posted June 15, 2014 Deputy Sheriffs Share Posted June 15, 2014 Tim, in most cases you can ignore thoese errors, espcially for flightsimming. The validation runs againts data from Eurocontrol and reflect e.g. certain restrictions etc. not part of the AIRAC. If you want to learn more about this, read this topic: http://forum.aerosoft.com/index.php?/topic/72444-cfmu-validation-errors-and-using-pfpx-auto-routing-to-fix-them/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timmy21790 2 Posted June 15, 2014 Author Share Posted June 15, 2014 I do know I can ignore them, but I do like to increase my realism by knowing that my route complies with the atc traffic rules, i.e having my route validated Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougsnow 50 Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 I do know I can ignore them, but I do like to increase my realism by knowing that my route complies with the atc traffic rules, i.e having my route validated Now you know why airlines have whole departments to deal with the mess of Eurocontrol... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torben Andersen 15 Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Hi Tim As Doug implies there are no simple way to make sure you get a valid route - trial and error works most of the time, but experience can cut some corners. This is what I do, taking your example ZHR - MAN as example. I first let PFPX try to find an upper route (perhaps you've done some of the same steps, perhaps not. But others might have tried without finding a solution). PFPX returns (leaving out the SID/STAR): 1st attempt: VEBIT T51 LASUN UN176 LUMEL UT10 TORPA UT40 LUL UL613 RLP UT10 DIDOR UL613 MOGLI UP6 LESTA I get 5 errors when trying to validate the route: PROF204: RS: TRAFFIC VIA STOAT IS ON FORBIDDEN ROUTE REF:[EG2158A] UL613 STOAT MOGLI PROF205: RS: TRAFFIC VIA TORPA UT40 LUL IS OFF MANDATORY ROUTE REF:[LF2954A] UT40 TORPA LUL PROF201: CANNOT CLIMB OR DESCEND ON RLP UT40 CTL IN FL RANGE F364..F390, BECAUSE OF UNAVAILABLE LEVELS ON UT10 PROF198: CTL UT10 DIDOR IS A CDR 3 IN FL RANGE F265..F500 PROF198: RLP UT10 CTL IS A CDR 3 IN FL RANGE F195..F500 I'll look at the errors as I meet them walking thru the route. So PROF205 is the first problem. The Route Availability Document (RAD) can be found at Eurocontrol: http://www.cfmu.eurocontrol.int/RAD/ Looking in the document regarding the French airspace (LF) you can search for LF2954 and the result is: UT40 TORPA LUL Not available for traffic DEP LS**, Basle Group Via RLP This traffic shall file TORPA UT10 RLP So I change the routing as stated in the RAD document are retries: 2nd attempt: VEBIT T51 LASUN UN176 LUMEL UT10 DIDOR UL613 MOGLI UP6 LESTA This removes the PROF205 error. The route envolves a CDR 3 restriction, which means that the airway has a restriction that doesn't allow you to use it for planning purposes. So the entire sector RLP to DIDOR must be replaced. Luckily UL613 is also a possibility between RLP and DIDOR, so I try this: 3rd attempt: VEBIT T51 LASUN UN176 LUMEL UT10 RLP UL613 MOGLI UP6 LESTA After validation only the first error remains: PROF204: RS: TRAFFIC VIA STOAT IS ON FORBIDDEN ROUTE REF:[EG2158A] UL613 STOAT MOGLI From the French/UK border I can use the UK Standard Route Document to give me a valid route from the FIR entry point to EGCC/MAN. The UK Standard Route document can be found at http://www.nats-uk.ead-it.com/aip/current/srd/SRDDOC.pdf My route enters UK airspace at SOVAT, so I lookup SOVAT in the SRD and get the route from SOVAT to EGCC/MAN: UL613 SANDY UN57 WELIN T420 TNT Incorporating this in PFPX gives the result: VEBIT T51 LASUN UN176 LUMEL UT10 RLP UL613 SANDY UN57 WELIN T420 TNT This route passes CFMU validation! But it is a puzzle - which can be fun or the opposite. cheers Torben Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Checkursix 3 Posted June 15, 2014 Share Posted June 15, 2014 Or look it up on vatroute.net and have a valid route in seconds for many major European city pairs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torben Andersen 15 Posted June 16, 2014 Share Posted June 16, 2014 If you want to get route suggestions from a more operational source than vatroute.net try EuroFpl.eu. Registration (free) is needed. Torben Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timmy21790 2 Posted June 17, 2014 Author Share Posted June 17, 2014 What about PROF201 errors which is unavailable levels on certain airways, any way around it? P.S that website you gave link to, absolute FAB! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torben Andersen 15 Posted June 18, 2014 Share Posted June 18, 2014 The only workaround I'm aware of is to use another airway, which allows you to climb/descend as needed. Perhaps some real-life dispatcher can comment on this, if there is another solution. Torben Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatrickM 49 Posted June 18, 2014 Share Posted June 18, 2014 What about PROF201 errors which is unavailable levels on certain airways, any way around it? P.S that website you gave link to, absolute FAB! Without knowing the exact error code, we can't help you. But anyway: check the RAD! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emi 5161 Posted June 18, 2014 Share Posted June 18, 2014 The only workaround I'm aware of is to use another airway, which allows you to climb/descend as needed. Perhaps some real-life dispatcher can comment on this, if there is another solution. Torben Well, simply adjust your vertical path to match what is required on your airways or use different airways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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