wiss 2 Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 Good evening everybody. I know there are some topics around here saying some variant of the new buses are either overpowered or underpowered, but I felt necessary to start a new topic since I made a couple of tests I would like to share. Today I flew EGKK-EGJJ with the A319 IAE. The first stage of the climb (immediately after take off) was painfully slow. Because I didn't achieve more than 1100 ft/min. In order to see if this was a random thing or something regular, I made a couple of tests. I used the following conditions: Runway: SCEL 17L (full runway, 3750 meters long, elevation is 1560 feet) Temperature: 11 C QNH: 1013 Winds: Calm The weather was generated with the default FSX weather engine, no external weather tool was used for these tests. Normally I use ASN, even for the mentioned EGKK-EGJJ flight. I made comparisons between the CFM and IAE A319. In both cases I used a gross weight of 61 tons during take off. I calculated my V Speeds with the MCDU, which gave me a FLEX temperature of 57 degrees. The IAE variant generated an EPR of more or less 1.293 with an N1 of 78%. Achieving a rate of climb of 1000-1100 ft/min on the initial climb. I used flaps 1+F. For comparison I tried the same take off but this time with TOGA. Getting about 1800 feet/min on the initial climb. The CFM A319 with FLEX 57 gave me an N1 of 92% (vs 78% with the IAE). It gave me an initial rate of climb of 3000 ft/min also with 1+F. Is that difference between the N1 values and rate of climb accurate when using the same flex temperature and same gross weight? Is important to say the rate of climb of the IAE A319 increases and equals the CFM A319 climb rate after retracting the flaps and reducing to CLB thrust. For comparison, I attempted a take off with the A320 IAE using the same runway and weather conditions. I used flaps 1+F.The MCDU suggested FLEX 60 when having a GW of 63400 kg. I achieved more or less an initial rate of climb of 2800 ft/min. From this I note the climb performance between the IAE and CFM A320 is pretty similar. The notable difference for me was that the A320 IAE gave me an EPR of 1.353 with FLEX 60 (N1 of 81%), while the A319 IAE with FLEX 57 gave me an EPR of 1.293. I know the IAE engines on the A319 are less powered than the A320 ones, but are those EPR differences accurate? I haven't compared the climb performance of the IAE and CFM A321 yet. I am using the 1.20 version with the 1.20b hotfix. Regards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airbus339 129 Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 It's an issue that was reported here http://forum.aerosoft.com/index.php?/topic/88647-a320-iae-initial-climb-performance/ Can you conferm that with SP2 is the same like the previous versions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiss 2 Posted December 17, 2014 Author Share Posted December 17, 2014 I have this issue with SP2 and the 1.20b hotfix. For me it seems to happen only with the A319 IAE. The A320 IAE has a normal climb performance. Haven't tested the A321 IAE yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerosoft Jonas S. 466 Posted December 17, 2014 Aerosoft Share Posted December 17, 2014 Version 1.21 has been released 1 hour ago. Please try this instead of the hotfix! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 Hi, I have just donea quick flight with a clean install and verision 1.21 with A320 IAE.... I am not sure if it´s solved. The A321 IAE , working OK: TOW: 68.000 kgs. Best. Miquel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiss 2 Posted December 17, 2014 Author Share Posted December 17, 2014 Version 1.21 has been released 1 hour ago. Please try this instead of the hotfix! Sure. I will make a full uninstall of the 1.20 version and then I will install the 1.21. I'm gonna test the performance of the A319 IAE again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Che. 1601 Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 Hi, I have just donea quick flight with a clean install and verision 1.21 with A320 IAE.... I am not sure if it´s solved. The A321 IAE , working OK: TOW: 68.000 kgs. Best. Miquel. Miquel, Off topic but after takeoff maintain V2+15 OR follow SRS commands. Do not try and hold the speed marker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 Hi, Joshua, another quick flight, and now everything seems OK. BTW, All other models CFM and IAE with A320-321, working perfectly. Thanks. Miquel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiss 2 Posted December 17, 2014 Author Share Posted December 17, 2014 Today I made a full uninstall of the 1.20 version. Then I ran ccleaner to eliminate any traces of it. After all that process I installed the 1.21 version. Unfortunately the problem persists on the A319 IAE, the initial climb rate is very slow. I made some tests with the same conditions I wrote on the first post. I attach some screenshots. The A319 IAE with FLEX 57 The A319 IAE with TOGA To compare, I attach some screenshots of the CFM A319 using FLEX 57 and TOGA under the same conditions of weight, weather, etc. The difference on the climb rate is very noticeable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Che. 1601 Posted December 18, 2014 Share Posted December 18, 2014 Today I made a full uninstall of the 1.20 version. Then I ran ccleaner to eliminate any traces of it. After all that process I installed the 1.21 version. Unfortunately the problem persists on the A319 IAE, the initial climb rate is very slow. I made some tests with the same conditions I wrote on the first post. I attach some screenshots. The A319 IAE with FLEX 57 a319iaeflex.png The A319 IAE with TOGA a319iaetoga.png To compare, I attach some screenshots of the CFM A319 using FLEX 57 and TOGA under the same conditions of weight, weather, etc. The difference on the climb rate is very noticeable a319cfmflex.png a319cfmtoga.png If you had search the forums, you would have found the answer to the difference between the CFM and the IAE. Lastly, I tried your situation for takeoff, my result was much better than yours. With this, I have nothing else left to say for this kind of IAE topics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiss 2 Posted December 18, 2014 Author Share Posted December 18, 2014 I serched the forums but I didn't find any topic regarding exclusively an A319 issue. Most topics were about all the IAE planes (A319, A320, A321) or the A320 only. That's why I created a new topic. Today I made more tests under the same conditions as before, in order to see if the issue was gone with the 1.21 version. The issue persists only on the A319 IAE. I have no problems with the A320 and A321 IAE. Considering this, I kindly ask why you and me have dramatically different climb rates under the very same weight, thrust and weather conditions. Or at least I ask if you could please point me to the topic where this was explained. Since I have made a couple of searches on the forum and I haven't found anything regarding this issue with the A319 only. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Che. 1601 Posted December 18, 2014 Share Posted December 18, 2014 I serched the forums but I didn't find any topic regarding exclusively an A319 issue. Most topics were about all the IAE planes (A319, A320, A321) or the A320 only. That's why I created a new topic. Today I made more tests under the same conditions as before, in order to see if the issue was gone with the 1.21 version. The issue persists only on the A319 IAE. I have no problems with the A320 and A321 IAE. Considering this, I kindly ask why you and me have dramatically different climb rates under the very same weight, thrust and weather conditions. Or at least I ask if you could please point me to the topic where this was explained. Since I have made a couple of searches on the forum and I haven't found anything regarding this issue with the A319 only. Thanks Well, since you so politely asked: The A319 CFM is fitted with 27K engines while the A319 IAE is fitted with 23.5K engines. We usually fit the highest thrust variant for each aircraft type and one that we have data on. Because of the reason above, its a complete invalid comparison to compare the two. Now, regarding of the "problem" which you think exist only on A319 IAE, see my screenshot above. That is the A319 IAE. FLEX temps definetely lowers climb rate, but a improper takeoff/climb procedure can simply bring the plane down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiss 2 Posted December 18, 2014 Author Share Posted December 18, 2014 While I understand we can't make a direct comparison between the CFM and IAE planes. Is possible that using the very same technique for take off for both variants can give very different climb rates? Because I do my take offs in the very same way for both A319s. May I ask what is your take off procedure? (not asking for a full explanation, just some aspects to take into account) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerosoft Aerosoft Team [Inactive Account] 51558 Posted December 18, 2014 Aerosoft Share Posted December 18, 2014 If the possible max thrust of the engines differs the climbrates will of course be different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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