chechen 1 Posted December 19, 2011 Share Posted December 19, 2011 Hi guys, I am new to the Cheyenne. Hot aircraft, but I am having a problem with FSX: When I fly at maximum speed with full power and pull the trottle to idle, it takes about 10 seconds (I did not stop the time) for the engines to respond. 10 seconds of nothing happening, except flying at full power and getting irritated.^^ When I fly at half power, engine response is immidiate, even though the turbines need some time to spool up or down. But at least I see that something is happening. Whats wrong? Thank you! :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaun Fletcher 571 Posted December 19, 2011 Share Posted December 19, 2011 Hello Chechen, This happens when you dont read the manual thoroughly, maybe a good idea to reread and see what you might be doing wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wingnut 60 Posted December 19, 2011 Share Posted December 19, 2011 Hello; You might also do a Google search,for the Piper Cheyenne flight characteristics,it tells you what you want to no,its just a small passenger plane,not an jet fighter,where you expect immediate throttle responce.Oh yea,I just checked the responce time of the engines,at ground idle,to full power took 7.5 seconds,I guess this will very with different systems. Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chechen 1 Posted December 19, 2011 Author Share Posted December 19, 2011 Hi Shaun, thanks for the kind answer. I'll check the manual thoroughly. Wingnut, I know that the engines are slow. I meant 10s from full power with idle thrustlevers to full power with first engine response. I dont know what is has to do with spooling time, since a cutoff of fuel should have an immediate effect. But perhaps its all hidden in the manual :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chechen 1 Posted December 20, 2011 Author Share Posted December 20, 2011 One more question here... where in the manual are you refering to? It just says "dont fly full throttle" and "use the performance tables". Besides that, the decribed effect is not mentioned there. I know I have to move the plane within its limits, but it's a simulator, so I use jerky control inputs and try to fly by just feeling the aircraft. No matter what - I think if I pull the throttle back at full power, something should happen at the engine controls. Yes, something happens... quickly... after the needles were nailed for 10 seconds. I think this is a limitation of the simulator, or do you guys are really trying to explain that this is completly 100% the same in real life? If so, I apologize for my ignorance. I have a similar problem with the Carenado Bonanza, I can fly it in a tight turn without losing speed and without exceeding the maximum AoA at maximum steering deflection. But again, perhaps it's only my perception cause I have never tried that in real life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wingnut 60 Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 Hello; I just did a Google search for the aircraft,and found that information.Heh,go to the old DA forum,here's the link,it has all kinds of useful information on this aircraft,hopefully it will help;http://www.digital-aviation.de/forum/viewforum.php?f=55&sid=0357a31adff1920861ff5a7d6c7bba5e. By the way,what kind of system are you running this on,and is it Fsx? Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chechen 1 Posted December 20, 2011 Author Share Posted December 20, 2011 Ah, thanks for the link! It mentions the fact there. I've got a fairly slow computer with FSX, just put a new ATI 6750 into it. If it runs at 30 fps, I am happy :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wingnut 60 Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 Hello; Yea,there's some good information there about the plane. Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaun Fletcher 571 Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 Hello Chechen, If you ram this aircraft into full throttle then you will have issues with the power settings they just wont respond. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snave 466 Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 Everything you describe is not a problem, it's a function of the engine control system used in older generation free turbines. So if you are flying at full power in direct contravention of the instructions, you an expect unfamiliar response to incorrect operation. The solution is to operate it properly - this takes a bit more time to get to grips with, but ultimately is more rewarding. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chechen 1 Posted December 25, 2011 Author Share Posted December 25, 2011 I know that :-) I just wanted to check how the simulated aircraft behaves if I don't stick to the rules. One other thing - the turn coordinator. I come out at 2:20 min for a full 360° turn. In the Beech Duke its even worse, 2:53 min. Whats wrong, another flaw in FSX? How do they want me to do IFR if the instruments dont work right? Is that another feature? *g* I didnt expect modern simulators to be that limited. I bought Jeppesen Flitepro in 2000, but it only runs sometimes on Win98 and Win2000. Jeppesen discontinued it, even though I found it very suitable for IFR training. Then there is Elite 8, but I find it too expensive. Any other ideas on how to practice IFR training? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EDNR-Cruiser 319 Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 Hi chechen, when you check the times in real aircraft you will notice that a 2min turn is rarely an exact 2min turn. The instruments are not too precise, environmental conditions (turbulences) can spoil your turn and YOU have to work very coordinated with rudder, ailerons, elevator and power settings to get there... - basically you have to fly the ball. Banking (and the 2min mark on you turn coordinator) is just one element. In real life you will also not make a 2min turn in 2 minutes if you just fly by the 2 min mark alone - the better you coordinate your controls the closer you will come to the 2 minutes result and while you are training you can use the same trick that pilots do: check you turn every 15 or 30 seconds and if your turn is too slow, bank harder and/or apply more rudder, if the turn is too fast reduce your bank angle and/or apply less rudder... - never forget: the most essential instruments for aviation are compass and CLOCK... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wingnut 60 Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 Hello; When you are performing a coordinated turn,following the turn coordinator,just keep the ball in the center,Emclosed is an article about the indicator;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turn_coordinator#Turn_coordinator mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snave 466 Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 No, a coordinated turn requires not just the turn coordinator, but also the correct bank angle to achieve the Standard Rate Turn http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ROT_(aviation) As EDNR notes, this requires proper pilotage throughout the manouevre, including adjustment for aerodynamic and weather effect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chechen 1 Posted December 26, 2011 Author Share Posted December 26, 2011 I have a PPL and know how to step the rudder. :-) I am just surprised by the high deviation of the turn coordinatior. It's almost three minutes in the Turbine Duke, something is definitly wrong there. Still I couldnt even find a maximum allowed tolerance in the FAR-AIM, maybe I look at the wrong place? Is there any way of editing the gauge so it will be more responsive? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snave 466 Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 No. But how are you measuring the elapsed time? Inside the sim, or externally? I don't have the Cheyenne installed at present, but the Turbine Duke did a 2.10 SRT not three minutes, using the internal timer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EDNR-Cruiser 319 Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 Hi chechen I did a check flight with the Cheyenne today and circled three times at 150kts in 5.000ft altitude using an external timer and finished a full circle between 2:07min and 2:18min, which is pretty close to what other planes do - as I found out later. When I compared these times with other aircraft (Katana 4x, several Carenado planes) I realized that turn times with the FSX seem to be on the slow side in general. In real life I tend to do my circling a bit faster than the standard (not much but rather in 1:50 to 1:55mins than 2:05 or 2:10mins). With FSX I seem to be a bit more relaxed as I never turned faster than in 2:00mins - not completely off but rather in the 2:10mins area when watching the instruments (and not the timer). I don't own the Duke so can't give you any numbers here but it seems that it is a bit more challenging to fly to the books with the FSX than in real life but again: real life means adaptation to external influences, too - not to speak of imperfect instrumentation... Happy landings, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chechen 1 Posted December 26, 2011 Author Share Posted December 26, 2011 I checked the Turbine Duke - 4500 ft, 200 kts - 2:55 at 23° bank., left and right turns. Correct bank would be (speed/10 + 7) 27°, but that does not accelerate the turn much. Used external timer, still internal and external timer don't differ. I will check the Cheyenne tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snave 466 Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 This would suggest something is amiss with the setup and response to flight modelling (usually caused by improper use of external frame rate limiters or bonkers mods to the FSX.cfg) or, given the consistency, something to do with the actual FSX installation assuming we have ruled out pilot error. FWIW, I subsequently flew another three SRT's in the Turbine Duke and got consistently 2.05-2.15, going both clockwise and counter-clockwise - figures which are so close to EDNR's that one must assume the inconsistency is at your end. Supply full systems specs including FS hardware. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chechen 1 Posted January 3, 2012 Author Share Posted January 3, 2012 Hm, my fsx.cfg may be messed up. I used the bojote tool to increase framerates and I dont have a working backup here. Its a dual core Athlon 5200, 2GB RAM, ATI 6750 graphic card. Frames locked at 30 fps with the internal limiter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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