eziocin 8 Posted November 10, 2011 Share Posted November 10, 2011 This is for Aerosoft Developers. As many other FSX simmers I am desperate about the infamous g3d.dll related CTD. Since I built up my new PC (See specs in the signature below)I have been flying with no issues for some time but now I have come to a point where I get a ctd on almost every flight. The CTDs occur mainly flying in Europe, but this is probably because I fly most og the times in Europe (I have UTX EU + several Aerosoft airports), and only during approach, getting closer to an addon airport, always around the same route fix. It is not aircraft related as it happens using different a/c. I have most of your major Airports installed...EDDM, LFMN, EBBR, EDDF, LFPG....etc.... Even though I recognise that I use very complex addons aircraft, such as the PMDG 737NGX, and a very high level of FSX settings, my PC has demonstrated to be capable to deliver very good performance even under the heaviest loads, as it has actually been performing extremely well for some months, with the same addons/settings that I currently have. So far, I have tried to rebuild the fsx.cfg (which is also optimised as per Boyote's online tool), reduced the scenery settings, running FSX without default PC settings (i.e no overclocking), flying with default a/c, removing AI traffic (UT2), but without any improvement: whenever I am performing an approach and I am within 15-30 NM range from a a major airport, I have a ctd. I also want to highlight that when the ctd occurs the resources of the pc are NOT hogged (I am having around 70% processor usage, 40 % for the GPU, with a GPU maximum memory use of 800 Mb, which for a GTX570 is not an extreme condition). Recently I made some interesting tests. I repeated three typical "CTD flights": LFMN-EDDM, LFMN-EDDF, LFMN-EBBR. Aircraft was PMDG737 NGX, major addons installed REX2 (with O/D), GEX, UTX, Aerosoft EBBR, LFMN, EDDM, EDDF, and ASE on networked laptop. Usually I can never complete any of those flights because of CTD, always occurring in the same location close to final destination.....very annoying.... Then I deactivated the destination airports and used default airports: no CTD at all......all flights completed more than once without CTD. Then I reactivated the Aerosoft Airports and deactivated UTX: no CTD at all....all flights completed successfully. Then I reactivated both Aerosoft apts and UTX and ...here we are again...CTD on all three flights. Important to highlight that in none of the crashed flights the PC resources were pushed at their boundaries. I used FSX in windowed mode so that I could have part of the desktop visible at all time during flight and I kept under control the screens of GPU-Z, CPU-Z, Real Temp and PC task manager on Performance section. CPU was running around 70% of the load, with random peaks at 90% (no affinity mask tweak used), GPU was a rock steady 40% loaded with GPU memory max usage 850 Mb (peak value...the average was around 450 Mb). My conclusions is that CTDs are not resource related....I bet they are the results of some conflicts between different add-ons, in this particular case between Aerosoft sceneries and UTX, or even the result of missing objects that FSX engine cannot render and crashes the sim. I am not blaming Aerosoft at all…..I love your airports and could not fly without, and I will also raise a similar thread on UTX forums, but I am asking you please to advise a solution, if any. Thank you 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaun Fletcher 570 Posted November 10, 2011 Share Posted November 10, 2011 Hello Jackson, You say not aircraft related, but have you tried the same flight with the default 737, did you also try the same flight at midnight when a different texture set may be loaded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bakern 11 Posted November 10, 2011 Share Posted November 10, 2011 Hi In theese days it's been so popular to look for missing GUID's in work against this "freakin" CTD's in FSX, i have been using this MissingLibraryAllert=1 in my FSX.cfg file and, when loading Aerosoft's EBBR v1.01 in FSX i find eleven missing GUID's!!! (Not Good in my eyes?) This was with FSX's Trike, with default EBBR i found one missing GUID. Maybe it's time for developers of scenery's to check this behavior in all scenery's they are making, maybe it will help against that "freakin" CTD all over. Just a thought...!! Brgds Stein-ove Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaun Fletcher 570 Posted November 10, 2011 Share Posted November 10, 2011 Hi In theese days it's been so popular to look for missing GUID's in work against this "freakin" CTD's in FSX, i have been using this MissingLibraryAllert=1 in my FSX.cfg file and, when loading Aerosoft's EBBR v1.01 in FSX i find eleven missing GUID's!!! (Not Good in my eyes?) This was with FSX's Trike, with default EBBR i found one missing GUID. Maybe it's time for developers of scenery's to check this behavior in all scenery's they are making, maybe it will help against that "freakin" CTD all over. Just a thought...!! Brgds Stein-ove But if this were indeed true that this caused a crash then would this not affect every single user of every single scenery that has an object/textures or whatever else was missing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eziocin 8 Posted November 10, 2011 Author Share Posted November 10, 2011 Hello Jackson, You say not aircraft related, but have you tried the same flight with the default 737, did you also try the same flight at midnight when a different texture set may be loaded. Hi Shaun, I have tried same flight with default 737, and also during night time, with no success. The only thing that allowed me to complete the flight was either to deactivate UTX or to deactivate your EDMM... Regards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bakern 11 Posted November 10, 2011 Share Posted November 10, 2011 But if this were indeed true that this caused a crash then would this not affect every single user of every single scenery that has an object/textures or whatever else was missing. Please, no offence, i'm trying to help, DO NOT get me wrong here. We must start somewhere to get rid off this behavior (CTD, G3D.DLL faults), that's all!!! But, If it's start's to making troubles for you, i'll better shut up!!! Ok. (I know, i'm not alone with this behavior at EBBR, check it yourself and you willl see) Stein-Ove Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deputy Sheriffs mopperle 4162 Posted November 11, 2011 Deputy Sheriffs Share Posted November 11, 2011 Stein-Ove, I understand what you mean, but after following many threads here at the Aerosoft forum and other forums I'm sure that this problem will never be solved until we have a completely new coded Flightsimulator. The g3d.dll error is as old as MS Flightsimulator: the oldest post I could find on Google dates back to the year 2003!!! Many people get this error during certain situation, like LOWI or EBBR (search the forum for it) or in other areas (e.g. Orbx). I never could reproduce them, although I got this error in other areas. But even for me I often could not reproduce this error. There are so many variables (hundreds of them?) related to this error, that makes it impossible to find the root cause. And all the suggestions/solutions you'll find on the web worked for some peoples and for others not. Not a really satisfying situation, but we have to live with it. Or may be one of the so called "solutions" might be helpfull for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaun Fletcher 570 Posted November 11, 2011 Share Posted November 11, 2011 Please, no offence, i'm trying to help, DO NOT get me wrong here. We must start somewhere to get rid off this behavior (CTD, G3D.DLL faults), that's all!!! But, If it's start's to making troubles for you, i'll better shut up!!! Ok. (I know, i'm not alone with this behavior at EBBR, check it yourself and you willl see) Stein-Ove No offence taken, as Otto puts it in context nicely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snave 466 Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 So we are clear, there is NO `g3d.dll` crash... What there seem to be is a number of CTD's that are evidenced by a crash of g3d.dll. At no point has anyone, anywhere produced any data that the crashes are consistent, persistent or unique to any one set of circumstances. It may be that the g3d.dll is crashing, but it is the trigger that needs to be established. Random conversations such as this have no technical merit whatosever. The g3d.dll module is a System process, originating from MS. System process errors are mainly due to problems with conflicting applications running on the PC, yes, but the methodology outlined above is a long way short of establishing that it is those two addons that are causing the system process failure. Bus repeatedly crashes into house. House is damaged. You don't blame the house. You can stop the accident by stopping the bus using that street OR you find out what caused the bus to hit it more than once, and fix that... And once again, the qualitative value of our OP's post is marred by the fact that `it` (not bothering to fill in your Profile makes me deeply suspicious of motive and ability) has posted its rant in a forum which definitively states is not for technical support. Especially when there is four pages of proper analysis over at Avsim replying to the same question from the same poster. These kind of things often give clues as the root cause of the problems (oh, look another one who uses Bojotes fsx.cfg tuning service...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bakern 11 Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 Stein-Ove, I understand what you mean, but after following many threads here at the Aerosoft forum and other forums I'm sure that this problem will never be solved until we have a completely new coded Flightsimulator. The g3d.dll error is as old as MS Flightsimulator: the oldest post I could find on Google dates back to the year 2003!!! Many people get this error during certain situation, like LOWI or EBBR (search the forum for it) or in other areas (e.g. Orbx). I never could reproduce them, although I got this error in other areas. But even for me I often could not reproduce this error. There are so many variables (hundreds of them?) related to this error, that makes it impossible to find the root cause. And all the suggestions/solutions you'll find on the web worked for some peoples and for others not. Not a really satisfying situation, but we have to live with it. Or may be one of the so called "solutions" might be helpfull for you. Thank's for answer. Just for info, i do not have many G3D.dll fault's on my computer, if it show's up, it's my fault. (overstress with detail and complex aircraft) But what about this issue, "MissingLibraryAllert=1", when loading Aerosoft's EBBR v1.01 in FSX i find eleven missing GUID's!!!" That's my question, if we can deal with this issue's as a start. Try it and you find it! I'm pretty sure thoose allert's are no good for anybody, with or without CTD or G3D.DLL fault's. What about this, every scenery designer must check for library allerts and missing textures before a new scenery comes out? (It's only two lines in FSX.cfg) But if this were indeed true that this caused a crash then would this not affect every single user of every single scenery that has an object/textures or whatever else was missing. Not necessarily, but most of Flightsimmers have many scenery, addon etc. etc. installed, and with a few missing items on several of thoose....., then we have a problem, that's my opinion on this. With computers pressed to maximum and sometimes over, it will be a problem. Brgds Stein-Ove Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deputy Sheriffs mopperle 4162 Posted November 12, 2011 Deputy Sheriffs Share Posted November 12, 2011 Stein-Ove, about the "Missing Libery Alerts": Very good example is LOWI: there were also missing liberary alerts and many people thought that this could be a reason for g3d.dll errors. At the end Gianni (the developer) released a patch to avoid this error (together with other improvments) but also stated clearly that he could not give a 100% guarantee that this would solve this specific error (he himself never had this error or could reproduce it). And indeed after a "g3d.dll free" period another very experienced user (Guenseli) had this error again. Conclusion (IMHO): missing liberary alerts are a minor bug with no serious impact on the stability of a product or even a g3d.dll error. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bakern 11 Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 Stein-Ove, about the "Missing Libery Alerts": Very good example is LOWI: there were also missing liberary alerts and many people thought that this could be a reason for g3d.dll errors. At the end Gianni (the developer) released a patch to avoid this error (together with other improvments) but also stated clearly that he could not give a 100% guarantee that this would solve this specific error (he himself never had this error or could reproduce it). And indeed after a "g3d.dll free" period another very experienced user (Guenseli) had this error again. Conclusion (IMHO): missing liberary alerts are a minor bug with no serious impact on the stability of a product or even a g3d.dll error. Applause to Gianni to take that step, to do so. Maybe other can follow, that's my aim, hopefully What about this, every scenery designer must check for library allerts and missing textures before a new scenery comes out? (It's only two lines in FSX.cfg) Stein-Ove Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eziocin 8 Posted November 12, 2011 Author Share Posted November 12, 2011 So we are clear, there is NO `g3d.dll` crash... What there seem to be is a number of CTD's that are evidenced by a crash of g3d.dll. At no point has anyone, anywhere produced any data that the crashes are consistent, persistent or unique to any one set of circumstances. It may be that the g3d.dll is crashing, but it is the trigger that needs to be established. Random conversations such as this have no technical merit whatosever. The g3d.dll module is a System process, originating from MS. System process errors are mainly due to problems with conflicting applications running on the PC, yes, but the methodology outlined above is a long way short of establishing that it is those two addons that are causing the system process failure. Bus repeatedly crashes into house. House is damaged. You don't blame the house. You can stop the accident by stopping the bus using that street OR you find out what caused the bus to hit it more than once, and fix that... And once again, the qualitative value of our OP's post is marred by the fact that `it` (not bothering to fill in your Profile makes me deeply suspicious of motive and ability) has posted its rant in a forum which definitively states is not for technical support. Especially when there is four pages of proper analysis over at Avsim replying to the same question from the same poster. These kind of things often give clues as the root cause of the problems (oh, look another one who uses Bojotes fsx.cfg tuning service...) Well, with all respect, g3d.dll crashes (or at least some of them) can be replicated or associated to particular circumstances...read carefully in the forums and you will find it clear..... But besides this little technical issue, the tone of your post is totally out of scope: I do have an issue (which many other simmers have) which occurs just when two particular Add-ons are both enabled but does not occur when one of them (regardless which is the one) is not enabled. More than obvious that I have politely involved the developers of those two add-ons to share this and looking for an advice.....without blaming anyone..and, if the conclusion is that crashes have got nothing to do with a conflict between the two addons (as you seem to be quite sure.....) I will be more than happy as I would hate to remove permanently each one of those.... If you feel that my "rant" is a waste of time, you'd better spend your time doing something else rather than posting considerations about profile filling, motive and ability, which unless I should have considered them as an expression of English humor (which I usually love), seemed to me uselessly offensive. Have a good day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smnielsen 10 Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 Applause to Gianni to take that step, to do so. Maybe other can follow, that's my aim, hopefully What about this, every scenery designer must check for library allerts and missing textures before a new scenery comes out? (It's only two lines in FSX.cfg) Stein-Ove I am with you on this Stein-Ove. And here is the link to a very interesting topic on Avsim Forum regarding g3d.dll crash and missing GUID's. http://forum.avsim.net/topic/353179-gd3dllhelp/ It is not just some ideas taken out from nowhere. IMHO every effort shoud be taken by scenery designers to eliminate missing GUID's. According to above topic, the g3d.dll module is looking up the Scenery Objects and if any GUID's is missing, it might very well end up in a g3d.dll crash. Where no GUID's is missing, my sim is smooth as silk, with no stutters or pauses, running the PMDG 737 NGX, UT2, UTX Europe, GEX EU-AFME, REX texture, ASE, UK2000 airports, Aerosoft airports, and other, on my very modest PC. Soeren 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eziocin 8 Posted November 12, 2011 Author Share Posted November 12, 2011 I am with you on this Stein-Ove. And here is the link to a very interesting topic on Avsim Forum regarding g3d.dll crash and missing GUID's. http://forum.avsim.n...179-gd3dllhelp/ It is not just some ideas taken out from nowhere. IMHO every effort shoud be taken by scenery designers to eliminate missing GUID's. According to above topic, the g3d.dll module is looking up the Scenery Objects and if any GUID's is missing, it might very well end up in a g3d.dll crash. Where no GUID's is missing, my sim is smooth as silk, with no stutters or pauses, running the PMDG 737 NGX, UT2, UTX Europe, GEX EU-AFME, REX texture, ASE, UK2000 airports, Aerosoft airports, and other, on my very modest PC. Soeren I raised that thread on Avsim Forums, because I strongly believe that CTDs have got nothing to do with PC resources usage. We have finally come to have hardware that can run beautifully our FSX with all sort of addons.....but we must get rid of these annoying CTDs,and to achieve this we need to take onboard the software developers. Regards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snave 466 Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 Please excuse my clumsy attempt at explaining things at your level. I clearly overestimated. THIS FORUM IS NOT FOR THESE KINDS OF DISCUSSIONS. THE CONCIDENCE OF FAILURE DOES NOT IMPLY CAUSATION. YOUR CONCLUSIONS ARE BASED ON NO METHODOLOGY WHATSOEVER. I hope that explains things more clearly... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eziocin 8 Posted November 12, 2011 Author Share Posted November 12, 2011 Please excuse my clumsy attempt at explaining things at your level. I clearly overestimated. THIS FORUM IS NOT FOR THESE KINDS OF DISCUSSIONS. THE CONCIDENCE OF FAILURE DOES NOT IMPLY CAUSATION. YOUR CONCLUSIONS ARE BASED ON NO METHODOLOGY WHATSOEVER. I hope that explains things more clearly... ....Clearly not English humour.......let's stop it here....you don't deserve additional replies... Bye... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bakern 11 Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 I am with you on this Stein-Ove. And here is the link to a very interesting topic on Avsim Forum regarding g3d.dll crash and missing GUID's. http://forum.avsim.n...179-gd3dllhelp/ It is not just some ideas taken out from nowhere. IMHO every effort shoud be taken by scenery designers to eliminate missing GUID's. According to above topic, the g3d.dll module is looking up the Scenery Objects and if any GUID's is missing, it might very well end up in a g3d.dll crash. Where no GUID's is missing, my sim is smooth as silk, with no stutters or pauses, running the PMDG 737 NGX, UT2, UTX Europe, GEX EU-AFME, REX texture, ASE, UK2000 airports, Aerosoft airports, and other, on my very modest PC. Soeren Thank you Soeren Stein-Ove Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bakern 11 Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Hi In theese days it's been so popular to look for missing GUID's in work against this "freakin" CTD's in FSX, i have been using this MissingLibraryAllert=1 in my FSX.cfg file and, when loading Aerosoft's EBBR v1.01 in FSX i find eleven missing GUID's!!! (Not Good in my eyes?) This was with FSX's Trike, with default EBBR i found one missing GUID. Maybe it's time for developers of scenery's to check this behavior in all scenery's they are making, maybe it will help against that "freakin" CTD all over. Just a thought...!! Brgds Stein-ove After some more testing i'm done with this scenery, over and out, i can not even fly over it in 37000 feet, when scenery load's, crash... Bye Bye Brussel, was nice to know you.... Have a nice evening Stein-Ove Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KAPTEJNLN 237 Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Well i had a look on it and what happens if you remove the file: AFX_EBBR.bgl does it then stil crash? I then have futher info when you told what happend just as side note all those msg you get can cause CTD i tryeid by just hold down the enter button and got CTD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snave 466 Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Simple question: How many `coincident` users of these two sceneries do NOT have the same crash..? ...Like I said, no causation link whatoever. If there were such a link then all, or nearly all, such users would share the same crash. They don't. And this is still a general discussion forum that does not do technical support. Fact. Fact. And yet more fact. The only proof is that those who are complaining most vociferously are the ones who have the least clue. There is no proven link that requires developer attention. Again, the testing methodology is flawed, based on target fixation by half-knowing users who've read something, somewhere, that they don't understand and believe that it implies something that applies universally. It doesn't. Even in the referenced topics there is no coincident setup issue. So what do the posters who are arbitrarily demanding a `developer` fix have to show that it is a developer problem that needs fixing..? Nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bakern 11 Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 And this is still a general discussion forum that does not do technical support. Sorry to ask, but are you this forums moderator? The only proof is that those who are complaining most vociferously are the ones who have the least clue. It is possible? Worse arrogance is hard to find....!! (Why don't look in the mirror and see, you will be surpriced.) Snave, for your info, i have been in this "Simworld" since the early morning, FS1, and build my computers on my own since early 90's, so please don't accuse me with this nonsense.... God day and bye to you. (where can i push to ignore this Gentleman) Edit: I find it. Cheers Stein-Ove 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bakern 11 Posted November 18, 2011 Share Posted November 18, 2011 Well i had a look on it and what happens if you remove the file: AFX_EBBR.bgl does it then stil crash? I then have futher info when you told what happend just as side note all those msg you get can cause CTD i tryeid by just hold down the enter button and got CTD Hi. Thank's for your feedback. I installed it again for a check, i did not get any error's (missing guid's) when starting at EBBR with a deactivated AFX_EBBR.bgl file, have not tested with a overfly yet. Brgds Stein-Ove Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KAPTEJNLN 237 Posted November 18, 2011 Share Posted November 18, 2011 ok futher tecnical talk about EBBR go to this post: http://forum.aerosof...__fromsearch__1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eziocin 8 Posted November 27, 2011 Author Share Posted November 27, 2011 Hello Jackson, You say not aircraft related, but have you tried the same flight with the default 737, did you also try the same flight at midnight when a different texture set may be loaded. Shaun, it took me some time to be able to reply but here's the fact: On a clean FSX install, with no other addon but UTX and some Aerosoft Airport this is what happens: - if I both UTX Europe and your EBBR, EDDM, EDDF are enabled, there is no chance I can complete any flight to either of the 3 airport...regardless the complexity of the a/c I am flying (from default a/c to PMDG NGX) I end up with a g3d.dll crash. Crashes occur always at the same geographical point (within 20 Nm from the airport) and there is no indication of PC resources hog. - If I disable UTX and leave your airports on, I can land in EBBR, EDDM, EDDF with no problems...no CTD - If I disable your airports and leave UTX on, I can land in EBBR, EDDM, EDDF, with no problems...no CTD All the above situations have been replicated several times. It might be not a very "scientific" procedure...but that's a fact....UTX and some of your airports together seem to go into some sort of conflict..... I know this is not a technical support forum...however I would really appreciate some comments and/or suggestion about the above issues... Thanks Regards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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