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When on final approach, to stabalise, what is more important... pitch attitude or throttle control?

 

my assumption was, and also based on watching real simulator tutors at work.. that the speed is constant but the pitch angle is changed

 

I feel like if you follow the attitude indicators guide, it wont match up with the papi lights. If you dont follow it, the announcement will be “unstable”

 

Is the airbus out of sync with fsx in terms of altitude and barometric pressure etc. As obviously I usually get the press B warning from fsx (though this occurs with fsx planes too)

 

looking for some clarity, thanks

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For example, in my last flight, the papi lights were all white, yet the plane was telling me to pitch up

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Throttle control (and so speed) is automatic untill you disable it by pressing the A/Thr button (not recommended). You could make some auto-land just following ILS path: what the aircraft does should be the correct thing.

3 minutes ago, Adam Chivers said:

For example, in my last flight, the papi lights were all white, yet the plane was telling me to pitch up

But in what conditions? During a non precision approach? Did you pass the DH?

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9 hours ago, Alessio75 said:

Throttle control (and so speed) is automatic untill you disable it by pressing the A/Thr button (not recommended). You could make some auto-land just following ILS path: what the aircraft does should be the correct thing.

But in what conditions? During a non precision approach? Did you pass the DH?

 

Basically if the ILS goes wrong and you come in above the glide slope and its too late to capture it. Or any other circumstance when you have to manually land the plane

 

All I was wondering in that instance was is it just the stick that is used? or are you meant to switch to manual throttle as well to stabilise?  


and if just the stick is used to manually land  i.e pitch and bank angles, is the plane in sync with the papi lights on fsx?

 

Unless doing a category 3 the AP will be disengaged and you finish the landing manually, but by then its so stable that theres little issue. I mean if you are from a long way out, or doing a visual approach

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As far I know,  Airbus do no recommend to turn off autothrust. So to keep the aircraft in the path I could use air brakes in order to diminishing the speed and increase vertical speed. If you miss the ILS path, you can follow it on PFD (pressing LS button, on side to the FD button) or on ND display trying to catch it again. In case of a non precision approach you can activate V/Dev dot on PFD diplay pressing APRR button (LS button off) and keep the path degree with the Trk function. So in all these cases, you should catch the right path again with Autopilot On and just in case you are too fast extend air brakes. Remember Airbus is an automatic aircraft so use the A/P functions.

However I am worried if I am too low. In case of I am too high, I would expect just to touch the runway a little long safely (of course as a simmer!! I am not a pilot!).  If not possible, start the Go Around procedure and repeat the manouver.

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On 5/11/2020 at 1:48 PM, Adam Chivers said:

For example, in my last flight, the papi lights were all white, yet the plane was telling me to pitch up

 

I found that in most sceneries the PAPI does actually not give you proper information in P3Dv4. Addon airports as well as default.
In real life, at least in our 737, we often get three reds on short final which is due to the PAPI being calibrated for the eye height of the largest aircraft normally using the airport.

The glideslope is also not positioned correctly relative to the aiming point in most addon sceneries.

 

What was the FMA when the plane told you to pitch up? Best would always be if you included screenshots of such situations.

 

Generally both pitch and thrust need to be stable. ANY aircraft can be flown by pitch and power setting. Set a certain thrust (in the small Airbusses that's normally Gross Weight-4 = N1) and a certain pitch attitude and the airplane will fly a certain speed and descent angle once stabilized.

 

If you use Autothrust or not is an airline philosophy. Boeing and Airbus say no. Then you have crashes like the MAX crashes where the pilots simply forgot the thrust at TOGA until impact.

Most airlines here in Europe have the philosophy to either turn both (AP and AT) on or off at the same time.

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1 hour ago, Alessio75 said:

As far I know,  Airbus do no recommend to turn off autothrust. So to keep the aircraft in the path I could use air brakes in order to diminishing the speed and increase vertical speed. If you miss the ILS path, you can follow it on PFD (pressing LS button, on side to the FD button) or on ND display trying to catch it again. In case of a non precision approach you can activate V/Dev dot on PFD diplay pressing APRR button (LS button off) and keep the path degree with the Trk function. So in all these cases, you should catch the right path again with Autopilot On and just in case you are too fast extend air brakes. Remember Airbus is an automatic aircraft so use the A/P functions.

However I am worried if I am too low. In case of I am too high, I would expect just to touch the runway a little long safely (of course as a simmer!! I am not a pilot!).  If not possible, start the Go Around procedure and repeat the manouver.


Thanks thats good to know I will try that next time

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1 hour ago, Emanuel Hagen said:

 

I found that in most sceneries the PAPI does actually not give you proper information in P3Dv4. Addon airports as well as default.
In real life, at least in our 737, we often get three reds on short final which is due to the PAPI being calibrated for the eye height of the largest aircraft normally using the airport.

The glideslope is also not positioned correctly relative to the aiming point in most addon sceneries.

 

What was the FMA when the plane told you to pitch up? Best would always be if you included screenshots of such situations.

 

Generally both pitch and thrust need to be stable. ANY aircraft can be flown by pitch and power setting. Set a certain thrust (in the small Airbusses that's normally Gross Weight-4 = N1) and a certain pitch attitude and the airplane will fly a certain speed and descent angle once stabilized.

 

If you use Autothrust or not is an airline philosophy. Boeing and Airbus say no. Then you have crashes like the MAX crashes where the pilots simply forgot the thrust at TOGA until impact.

Most airlines here in Europe have the philosophy to either turn both (AP and AT) on or off at the same time.

Thanks for the advice, good to learn something new about papi lights. I cant remember what was on the fma, but ap was disengaged by myself to fly the approach manually. LS was still on so I imagine the attitude indicator was telling me to pitch up to find the glide slope. Next time I will take a screenshot, but all was normal just disengaged the AP early thinking it wouldnt find the glide slope as it was just after the final turn. Is there a way you can capture the glide slope before final turn? As far as I know if you hit approach facing away from the runway the Localiser is wrong way round and plane will go all over the place. Its as if when on final turn you have to be spot on other wise g/s will slip away by the time you turn into an acceptable localiser angle 

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55 minutes ago, Adam Chivers said:

Thanks for the advice, good to learn something new about papi lights. I cant remember what was on the fma, but ap was disengaged by myself to fly the approach manually. LS was still on so I imagine the attitude indicator was telling me to pitch up to find the glide slope. Next time I will take a screenshot, but all was normal just disengaged the AP early thinking it wouldnt find the glide slope as it was just after the final turn. Is there a way you can capture the glide slope before final turn? As far as I know if you hit approach facing away from the runway the Localiser is wrong way round and plane will go all over the place. Its as if when on final turn you have to be spot on other wise g/s will slip away by the time you turn into an acceptable localiser angle 

 

The A320 series does not have a localizer backcourse feature, you can hit the APPR button at angles greater than 90° as well. However it will not capture the glideslope before you have localizer capture. So there'd be no use doing so.

 

The FMA reading is vital, the FMA is the way the aircraft communicates with you. Just because you selected something on the FCU it would by far not automatically be doing that. You need to check it's doing what it's supposed to do. As an example you might have hit Approach at a wrong point in time and it did arm, but not engage. The FMA will tell you. The FCU won't.

Never ever rely on the automation doing something which you have not 100% confirmed it is actually doing. The moment you fail to check the automation is the moment where the aircraft flies you and not the other way round.

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6 hours ago, Emanuel Hagen said:

 

The A320 series does not have a localizer backcourse feature, you can hit the APPR button at angles greater than 90° as well. However it will not capture the glideslope before you have localizer capture. So there'd be no use doing so.

 

The FMA reading is vital, the FMA is the way the aircraft communicates with you. Just because you selected something on the FCU it would by far not automatically be doing that. You need to check it's doing what it's supposed to do. As an example you might have hit Approach at a wrong point in time and it did arm, but not engage. The FMA will tell you. The FCU won't.

Never ever rely on the automation doing something which you have not 100% confirmed it is actually doing. The moment you fail to check the automation is the moment where the aircraft flies you and not the other way round.


Great point thanks, sometimes the altitude selector knob glitches in mine so checking the fma is vital at times. I could re install again but its not doing some bad things it did before and I'm happy with it as is. 
 

So are you saying glide slope cant be captured until the localiser is?

 

Whilst we are here, how do you determine which altitude to put in at top of descent? I usually aim for *2500 on the mcdu or whatever rounded figure waypoint is just before the runway. I don't think that is correct procedure is it?

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33 minutes ago, Adam Chivers said:

So are you saying glide slope cant be captured until the localiser is?

 

Yes

 

  

33 minutes ago, Adam Chivers said:

Whilst we are here, how do you determine which altitude to put in at top of descent? I usually aim for *2500 on the mcdu or whatever rounded figure waypoint is just before the runway. I don't think that is correct procedure is it?

 

I insert whatever level ATC clears me for. All I do is to request descent, which level I get cleared to is up to ATC.

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4 minutes ago, Emanuel Hagen said:

 

Yes

 

  

 

I insert whatever level ATC clears me for. All I do is to request descent, which level I get cleared to is up to ATC.


Thanks, does the aerosoft a320 work well with fsx atc? Ive been desperate to try it out just haven't got round to it

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9 minutes ago, Adam Chivers said:


Thanks, does the aerosoft a320 work well with fsx atc? Ive been desperate to try it out just haven't got round to it

 

Never tried it with FSX ATC, I either provide my own ATC or fly online.

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21 minutes ago, Emanuel Hagen said:

 

Never tried it with FSX ATC, I either provide my own ATC or fly online.

Ok, well I will try it out tomorrow see how it goes. Thanks for the help 

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