clearifying fbw-technique

[mattiss 4]

As an "old-fashion" pilot this clip really got me to get the grip of FBW. Big difference but a bit new; more like "hey, I just give the command and then the computers do the rest" but anyhow; TO and maneuvering (except for the annoying nosedive on final) really works out just like in the clip, but you have to give distinct, precise commands on the joystick and, if you are flying manually, compensate in pitch when you alter the throttle. Here´s the clip:

Have fun, Mats

[mattiss 4]

And when yopu have given those precise, sharp commands on the joystick; just let the joystick be and the plane will continue in the line of your command. Kind of scary but in the same time quite fascinating....

[mattiss 4]

Just completed a full IFR approach on Manchester 24R without any assistance from A/T / AP at all and with FBW active. By giving steering inputs to the system as described above, the approach and touchdown was steady as a rock right on the centerline. It seems (at least do I think so) that the nose-down bug is somewhat speed sensitive. I choosed 10-12 kts above VREF and did not experience any nose-down tendency. Anyone else that have the same experience?

[Paul Golding 159]

Just completed a full IFR approach on Manchester 24R without any assistance from A/T / AP at all and with FBW active. By giving steering inputs to the system as described above, the approach and touchdown was steady as a rock right on the centerline. It seems (at least do I think so) that the nose-down bug is somewhat speed sensitive. I choosed 10-12 kts above VREF and did not experience any nose-down tendency. Anyone else that have the same experience?

I've not had the nose dip at 100ft on any landing with 1.21 and like you, am wondering what it is that some users are doing to give rise to complaints.

[mattiss 4]

Maybe it´s like when the JAS-39 Gripen crashed (with swedens most experienced test pilot in command) twice in just a couple of years, i.e due to pilot induced oscillations. When he crashed at Långholmen in central Stockholm, with 100 000 spectators surrounding the scene, he made something like 20 joystick commands in 10 seconds and thus came in disharmony with the system of computers. Someone said: he only had to loosen his grip of the stick, and the plane wouldn´t have crashed. I suppose that the majority who complains of the Airbus X and its handling, is exatly in the same position as I were two weeks ago: trying to fly the bird in a conventional manner wich is doomed to failure and confusion. We, as sim pilots with a vast difference in experience and times IRL in an airplane, must help each other out and try not to get irritated when fellows ask different questions about our common interest. After all, we all seek the same satisfaction, regardless of our previous experience.

Have fun, Mats

[cbd80 258]

Airbus X definately needs delicate control inputs, and so too does the real Airbus. If you've heavy handed, leave decisions too late then you are going to get into trouble.

I can fly Airbus X without issue into challenging airports like Quito in Ecuador. Surely this won't be possible with such bad flight dynamics??

I think some users need patience and practice.

Chris

[MWR 36]

Chris.

Although I'm not sure about all the problems being reported by some users it is not as simple as that. For myself. I can fly the Airbus manually without issues except for one very important problem...At the point I disconnect the autopilot the aircraft pitches up quite strongly before settling back into normal flight. As you can imagine. If you are flying an ILS on autopilot and then revert to manual then you're instantly pitched above the glidepath. Interestingly, if I watch the aircraft from a tail view whilst disconnecting the autopilot I can clearly see the elevators apply a strong pitch up and then slowly adjust themselves to a normal attitude. Now. Whether this is related to a problem with certain systems or input devices, (yokes/joysticks), I don't know but there is an issue. I've flown a number of test flights and looked into this as deeply as I can but get nowhere. Others are suffering from this and have posted in a previous thread. Perhaps it's just me but it is rather annoying to see posts that infer that if you have a problem you just can't fly the aeroplane correctly. As there have been previous issues, now solved, which were system related perhaps this is the same?

[cbd80 258]

MWR.

Apologies for any offence. Indeed there is an issue, you are correct, however I do believe it can be overcome with practice.

When the Autopilot is disconnected the code reverts back to the FSX FBW, which has the effect of resetting the trim. During testing many things were tried to resolve this, and this is the best that we have been able to get it. I do hope it can be improved in future, but for now we must live with it.

As you are aware that it will happen you can compensate for it by being ready to give a little nose down and also retrim to regain control of the aircraft quickly.

When disconnecting on an ILS approach, I would do it when you have sufficient altitude and distance to recover i.e. 2500ft and 10nm.

It's not perfect, but for now some of these issues can be overcome by the pilot.

Chris

[MWR 36]

MWR.

Apologies for any offence. Indeed there is an issue, you are correct, however I do believe it can be overcome with practice.

When the Autopilot is disconnected the code reverts back to the FSX FBW, which has the effect of resetting the trim. During testing many things were tried to resolve this, and this is the best that we have been able to get it. I do hope it can be improved in future, but for now we must live with it.

As you are aware that it will happen you can compensate for it by being ready to give a little nose down and also retrim to regain control of the aircraft quickly.

When disconnecting on an ILS approach, I would do it when you have sufficient altitude and distance to recover i.e. 2500ft and 10nm.

It's not perfect, but for now some of these issues can be overcome by the pilot.

Chris

Thanks Chris. I didn't mean to appear aggressive. Thanks for your info which is very useful as I've posted about this on a number of occassions but yours is the first reply that explains there is an awareness of this issue. I find the 'deselct SEC' option the best at the moment if I'm going to revert to a manual approach as the pitch up is very difficult to smooth out as the push forward is inevitably followed by the FBW system pitching the aircraft nose down so it's extremely difficult to smooth out without spoiling the realism of the flight. I do hope a solution is found as, for me at least, it spoils a very good aircraft.

[mattiss 4]

You are right, that´s a problem still even if I (in an euphoric state of mind) said that the approach went "steady as a rock". To fly the bird with full "conventional" control U have to disable FBW. And, if you stay on with FBW enabled, disconnecting AP with a big margin (i.e 10 nm before touchdown) feel´s a bit overkill somewhat. Well, people, it´s certainly a complicated matter to get this working with a lot of default FS properties interfering, I can understand that. Hopefully, there will be a solution. Me myself is right now very happy to just be a user instead of developer....

The most important in this forum is, however, that we keep a good manner and the latter comments in this thread is certainly good examples of a polite and civilized way of communication. Keep it up, folks.