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SAITEK'S X-65F PRO FLIGHT SYSTEM


777cpt

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  • Aerosoft
Interesting, and thanks for the report. Must give one a try sometime as I really get annoyed about the centre sloppiness in standard controllers.

If you are short of cash, don't try it. This is really one of those things you will want when you touch it. Like the iPad.

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I am a big fan of Saitek and now have their X52; I have always found their tech support very helpful .................................BUT £330???? I think I'll wait.

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I am a big fan of Saitek and now have their X52; I have always found their tech support very helpful .................................BUT £330???? I think I'll wait.

I don't think the price is going to go down much, And besides You get what you pay for ;)

My current joystick does not center right right, and it is really annoying. If i had the money (and i didnt want something else) I would have gotten this.

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I am waiting anxiously for more feedback from the heli troops out there on this control system. If it is good as everybody says, it will be a no-brainer for heli's, especially if it doesn't 'spring-back' when you release tension as current joysticks always push back, which makes long flights tiresome. Please, more heli feedback!

Mathijs, it's cool you have a wide range of 'rides'...Chrysler 300 and a Lotus? Talk about differences!

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  • Aerosoft

I am waiting anxiously for more feedback from the heli troops out there on this control system. If it is good as everybody says, it will be a no-brainer for heli's, especially if it doesn't 'spring-back' when you release tension as current joysticks always push back, which makes long flights tiresome. Please, more heli feedback!

Mathijs, it's cool you have a wide range of 'rides'...Chrysler 300 and a Lotus? Talk about differences!

I did not find it particular good for choppers because you tend to need a constant 'force' when you fly. I find that a bit easier when I get some feedback in the angle of the stick then it is with 'force'. But I am not a very good chopper pilot, so perhaps that's just my idea.

And yes... always been a fan of special cars (the C300 is very rare here in France). As long as you don't mix them up driving it's great fun.

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  • Aerosoft

Mathijs Kok (Aerosoft), if you like cars get a Shelby GT500 Mustang or a Fiat 500 ( Pop, Lounge or Sport )

Not to hijack a topic, but we got a 500 Abarth as well. My wife likes it fast as well. Wicked little car. No Mustang for me, though the 2008/2009 version got reasonable suspension it's still not much fun.

To get back on topic.... does anybody know how to get the X65 programming software? The Saitek site does not seem to know about the stick and the link in the software that came with the stick is not correct (but I got a very early production version so perhaps that better.

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Not to hijack a topic, but we got a 500 Abarth as well. My wife likes it fast as well. Wicked little car. No Mustang for me, though the 2008/2009 version got reasonable suspension it's still not much fun.

To get back on topic.... does anybody know how to get the X65 programming software? The Saitek site does not seem to know about the stick and the link in the software that came with the stick is not correct (but I got a very early production version so perhaps that better.

Just to add to this again, its been a good couple of weeks with the X-65F now and I'm still loving it ... agree with Mathijs about FSX helicopter usage, at first I felt this was going to be a waste of time, whereas with more conventional aircraft it was strange at first but adapting was oh so quick. However ... after swapping back to my trusty X52 pro for Helicopters, it felt horrible, so I've been practising more with FSX Helicopters with the X-65F and now feel comfortable with them ... its definitely more easy to transition from normal sticks to force sensing with conventional aircraft than it is for Helicopter usage ... but I can do all the FSX Helicopter training missions with the X-65F now including the last one where you need to land on a moving Yacht.

For Helicopter usage you definitely want the lightest force setting and just hold the stick grip very lightly, you soon don't even notice you are applying a constant fwd pressure to maintain fwd flight, once in the hover press the button on the left console for the highest force setting and I can do very precise on the spot hovering that you need to do in some of the FSX missions.

If you go into the X-65F's OS calibration screen to test all the buttons and hats, at the softest setting you will see that even pressing a button or moving a hat will make the stick move in the calibration software ... don't worry, in normal use this is never a problem, but it made me realise just how sensitive the X-65F can be at softest setting ... so with more practise I find I don't even realise I'm pushing fwd slightly on the stick with the palm of my hand for Helicopters to maintain fwd flight.

For fixed wing aircraft the opposite seems to be true, in level flight and slow gentle turns or lining up for finals the higher or mid force setting seems best, but more enthusiastic flying benefits the softer force setting, fortunately these can be adjusted without pause in mid flight ... probably like the real thing? I bought Flaming Cliffs 2 last week and this is certainly true in this sim when you go into combat.

As regards the price, well you really do get what you pay for, this is Saitek's flagship and is their best quality product to date IMHO from them ( I own the X-52pro and all the pro flight GA gear ) its much better quality than my TM Cougar as well. The X-65F's solid all metal construction oozes quality, the actual texture where you grip the throttles and stick is very good, its not gloss smooth like the Cougar, nor is it rough, it just feels perfect to hold. The stiff throttles have eased off as everyone says and are now perfectly usable. The stick has a light green back glow from two of the sticks hats, the mode leds light up on the left console to show what programmed mode you are in and the force setting F1 F2 F3 F4 will light up unobtrusively to let you see what force setting you are on at a glance, all useful when flying a night flight in a darkened room as I like to do, but it does not light up like a multi coloured Christmas tree like the X-52 pro does that I always thought was a bit too gimmicky ... though in fairness you can tune those lights down to practically nothing in the X-52 software.

You get four basic force sensing settings, but you can adjust them or make your own with the provided software ... so far I'm happy enough with the provided ones.

Its a keeper, best HOTAS I've tried to date including the Logitech G940, Saitek X-52pro and TM Cougar ... the forthcoming TM Warthog HOTAS will have dual throttle and hall sensors, but its going to have to be very good indeed to beat the X-65F I reckon.

Its great to have choices in this gloomy recession. Flight Sim and especially combat flight sims and hardware seems to be bouncing back ... GA flight sim is healthy and its future looks positive despite the loss of MS Aces and the FS franchise thanks to the likes of Aerosoft for picking up the ball ... the future is looking very good for our hobby.

Cheers.

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does anybody know how to get the X65 programming software? The Saitek site does not seem to know about the stick and the link in the software that came with the stick is not correct (but I got a very early production version so perhaps that better.

Just spotted that part ... if you still need this Mathijas, I can send you a copy of my Saitek X-65F CD, its about 159MB in total, too big for email unfortunately.

Saitek are slow to get their new drivers and software on the site I agree.

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For Helicopter usage you definitely want the lightest force setting and just hold the stick grip very lightly, you soon don't even notice you are applying a constant fwd pressure to maintain fwd flight, once in the hover press the button on the left console for the highest force setting and I can do very precise on the spot hovering that you need to do in some of the FSX missions.

Hmmnn...

So, there is SOME self-centering effect on the X-65F from what I'm understanding here. Is that adjustable in the software, or is it a hardware issue? I'm curious as too how long you flew a heli for using it.

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Hmmnn...

So, there is SOME self-centering effect on the X-65F from what I'm understanding here. Is that adjustable in the software, or is it a hardware issue? I'm curious as too how long you flew a heli for using it.

Of course there is, if you let go it centres, however, if you continue to hold the stick fwd at softest force sensing it becomes almost a part of you ... or you just forget you are doing it. In most normal FSX Heli fwd flight motion at softest force setting it needs very little pressure ... your brain will adjust, its a world away from the monster right biceps that used to identify you as a TM Cougar owner trying to do the same :lol:

If you are looking for heli trim so you can free your right hand in FSX heli flights, then no ... you do get trim in REAL Helicopters but that is something lacking in the FSX flight models, this is something we need in future Heli sims ... it exists in Black Shark.

The lack of natural helicopter trim is a faction lacking IN FSX ... not any hardware.

But because of that, this was one of my biggest concerns of the unit, because I like Helicopter flying in FSX a lot ... I put in some extra hours with FSX Heli's, including trying the training missions all over again ... How many hours in FSX Heli's? I don't know ... about 4 at a guess since I bought the X-65F.

I've owned the X-65F for about two weeks now ... about the only thing I've not tried are FSX gliders.

It could be that we are confusing your need for Heli centring with Heli trim in fwd flight? ... or vice versa? its late now and I'll check back again.

Cheers.

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its a world away from the monster right biceps that used to identify you as a TM Cougar owner trying to do the same :lol:

...The lack of natural helicopter trim is a faction lacking IN FSX ... not any hardware...

... How many hours in FSX Heli's? I don't know ... about 4 at a guess since I bought the X-65F...

Cheers.

Well, your's is a very convincing argument for purchasing the X-65F this summer after I build my 'new' FSX computer. My old (dead) PC that I used FS9 on had a game port that I could connect my old MS Sidewinder Force Feedback. I used to fly heli's on that, and just leave the power cord unplugged, so that would kind of stay where I left it, in a forced trim state. Of course gameports are not supported anymore ( :( ), so that went by the wayside. I hate to admit it, but I have had the best results flying FSX heli's with a standard XBox 360 controller, as I can shift my entire hand around so I am not constantly applying trim. Hopefully Aerosoft will honor the heli pilots with trim ability with their FS version. :bow_down2_s:

I've suggested to both the CH Products and Saitek folks that there is a market for helicopter FS controls, but they responded it would be 'limited', and therefore not a great focus for them. Hrrmmphh.

Thanks for the insight.

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Just spotted that part ... if you still need this Mathijas, I can send you a copy of my Saitek X-65F CD, its about 159MB in total, too big for email unfortunately.

Saitek are slow to get their new drivers and software on the site I agree.

Mathijas, it looks like you can download the X-65F SST software in following links.

SST 32 bit

SST 64 bit

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Well, your's is a very convincing argument for purchasing the X-65F this summer after I build my 'new' FSX computer. My old (dead) PC that I used FS9 on had a game port that I could connect my old MS Sidewinder Force Feedback. I used to fly heli's on that, and just leave the power cord unplugged, so that would kind of stay where I left it, in a forced trim state. Of course gameports are not supported anymore ( :( ), so that went by the wayside. I hate to admit it, but I have had the best results flying FSX heli's with a standard XBox 360 controller, as I can shift my entire hand around so I am not constantly applying trim. Hopefully Aerosoft will honor the heli pilots with trim ability with their FS version. :bow_down2_s:

I've suggested to both the CH Products and Saitek folks that there is a market for helicopter FS controls, but they responded it would be 'limited', and therefore not a great focus for them. Hrrmmphh.

Thanks for the insight.

S'funny that. I also got the same reply from CH Products. While I can see the argument for the Collective I must admit the Cyclic has me baffled - most stick-equipped aircraft pivot on the floor, or at least at the end of a long lever arm... so would have use throughout sim-dom.

I suggested a couple of technically simples (eek! ^_^ ) way of doing so, using slightly modified versions of their current hardware but they were clearly disinterested.

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  • Aerosoft

S'funny that. I also got the same reply from CH Products. While I can see the argument for the Collective I must admit the Cyclic has me baffled - most stick-equipped aircraft pivot on the floor, or at least at the end of a long lever arm... so would have use throughout sim-dom.

I suggested a couple of technically simples (eek! ^_^ ) way of doing so, using slightly modified versions of their current hardware but they were clearly disinterested.

Believe me, this kind of hardware is hugely expensive to develop and market, they really have to focus on the big markets and helicopters just aren't that.

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Believe me, this kind of hardware is hugely expensive to develop and market, they really have to focus on the big markets and helicopters just aren't that.

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I've had an X52 for about four years and have been very interested in M31's experiences with the X-65F. The time for a change is approaching and I'm hopeful that Saitek will be represented at the Weston Super Mare Flight Sim Show on May 15th and 16th next month. A hands on experience is better than a thousand words but the pictures and your own observations were and continue to be most helpful. One thing would be helpful to know. Does the X-65F have a button for the TrackIR4 reset and centralize functions rather than scrabbling for F9 and F12 on the keyboards? Not enough reason in itself for coughing up with 300 smackers but it would be nice to know.

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  • Aerosoft

I've had an X52 for about four years and have been very interested in M31's experiences with the X-65F. The time for a change is approaching and I'm hopeful that Saitek will be represented at the Weston Super Mare Flight Sim Show on May 15th and 16th next month. A hands on experience is better than a thousand words but the pictures and your own observations were and continue to be most helpful. One thing would be helpful to know. Does the X-65F have a button for the TrackIR4 reset and centralize functions rather than scrabbling for F9 and F12 on the keyboards? Not enough reason in itself for coughing up with 300 smackers but it would be nice to know.

There is not a specific button for that but it's dead easy to program any of the gazillion buttons for that.

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The kind of hardware for true FSX/FS9 helicopters does exist now, but its a very exclusive club and ultra expensive too.

I saw a review back in PC Pilot of a very good dedicated Helicopter Cyclic rudder and Collective controller review, they said it worked brilliantly ... but *cough* They are not the greatest of reviewers *cough* they are bought reviewers* Or at best, just give rough ideas about things :)

I'll say no more about them, apart from its an interesting read in the bath.

Dedicated Helicopter controller's do exist though, but in small numbers ... and you are going to have to pay mega bucks, and this just for simple GA helicopter controllers.

My link

I think the most dynamic PC Flight Sim controller company are still Thrustmaster, they are about to throw forth the new TM Warthog HOTAS to us ... rumour is, CH might follow too.

Pictures are starting to leak of the new TM Warthog HOTAS in drip feeds ... what do we know already? its all metal construction, just like the old Cougar and new X-65F, its not force sensing ... they are boasting hall sensors, its dual throttle, it has (probably) an interchangeable joystick handle, meaning its a later model A-10 they are modelling?

That trim control on the base of the TM Warthog throttle will eventually turn out to be a throttle friction dial ... we'll see :)

bigblaff.jpg

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  • Aerosoft

Check out this review.

As we sell the thing we can't do a serious review, but his words would be very close to my own words. This is one kick ass bit of hardware. Costs a bit for sure but if you are serious about simming you should find a place to try this one out.

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Check out this review.

As we sell the thing we can't do a serious review, but his words would be very close to my own words. This is one kick ass bit of hardware. Costs a bit for sure but if you are serious about simming you should find a place to try this one out.

Pretty fair review, though these things are always subjective I guess? The SimHQ full review is due out very soon and prospective buyers should watch out for that one, its supposed to be very comprehensive.

I don't find the throttle switches on the front of the unit obtrusive and have never accidentally triggered them using the throttle arc, maybe if it was mounted too low or high? it would not be a HOTAS if switches and hats were not on the unit :unsure:

I've always thought Flight sim controller ergonomics were very important and spent a bit of time years ago making my flight sim desks and seating comfortable to use for long periods of time, right down to monitor height and viewing distance, ETC ... the controllers, especially something like this need to be at the right height and reach and solidly mounted, the pedals should be comfortable for your seat height and you should be able to use the full motion of the pedals and toe brakes without shifting in the seat, goes without saying that once the perfect position for the pedals is found, some means of making them not shift about should be found too ... this may all seem obvious but I see from many other set ups its often overlooked.

Cheers.

EDIT: Here is SimHQ's preview of the X-65F, yes its a lady doing the preview, but if you click on the link on her profile you will see how qualified she is ... it will be interesting to see that sites full review very soon ... and no, I'm not affiliated with them whatsoever :D

X 65F preview

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