Hughes H1-b No Metallic Reflections

[Frank-P 0]

Hello to everybody,

I have a problem with my Hughes HB-1 for the FSX (download version):

The Hughes H1-B has in my enviroment almost no metalic reflections on the body when viewed from the outside. It looks just dark grey. From the inside cockpit-view the front part of the body looks metallic. From the outside the front part looks a littel bit more metallic than the part behind the pilot.

This looking keeps the same all the time, independent of the choosen weather.

I have FSX with Acceleration package installed. Further on UTX-Europe/USA/Canada, FEX, GEX, FTX and some planes. Everything is running on Windows XP SP3, DirectX 9.0c

Has anyone the same problem? Does anybody know how to fix it? (Other planes, e.g. the North American PD51 from the acceleration package look correct, means it has a metallic look of the body of the plane)

Thanks for any hint

[Shaun Fletcher 570]

Hello Frank,

Can you attach some screenshots please.

[Frank-P 0]

Hello Shaun,

I attached some pictures. Thanks for your fast reaction.

Regards Frank

[Shaun Fletcher 570]

Hello Frank,

What graphics card are you using and do you have the latest drivers.

[Frank-P 0]

Hello Shaun,

I'm using a GTS 8800, 640 MByte

Driver-version is actual from the following package: nv17519_Win2KXP.zip

(or naming of installed driver: 6.14.11.7519 in driver-properties)

There exists a newer one at asus (as almost everytime). I will test it tomorow.

I would expect, that the most actual driver from 26.10.2008, as the one installed, download from asus should work on a not brand actual product. Is this a wrong assumption?

I will respond with the result:-). I'm just wondering, that a P51D works fine, and not a Hughes H1-B. Are there so many possibilities in creating metallic reflections? One day I'll have to read the SDK to understand more of the modelling in the FSX:-)

Regards Frank

[Frank-P 0]

Hello Shaun,

I upgraded to driver-Version: 6.14.11.8206

installed form package nv18206_Win2KXP.zip, downloaded form asus.

The problem stays the same.

Is it possible, that the outside testures are stored in a different way? I attach another screenshoot wich shows the top of the airplane and a part of the side. The top seems to be modeled and viewed as expected. The side part is dark gray. Therefore, as far as I understood, there seems to be a difference on these textures as they get handled. Why the outsides are grey and not e.g. the top-part of the body?

I like to avoid trying one display-driver after the other without getting a succes and like therefore understand a bit more of the problem. Can it be easy explained?

Thanks for any help.

Regards

Frank

[Stefan Hoffmann 4160]

Hello Shaun,

I upgraded to driver-Version: 6.14.11.8206

installed form package nv18206_Win2KXP.zip, downloaded form asus.

The problem stays the same.

Is it possible, that the outside testures are stored in a different way? I attach another screenshoot wich shows the top of the airplane and a part of the side. The top seems to be modeled and viewed as expected. The side part is dark gray. Therefore, as far as I understood, there seems to be a difference on these textures as they get handled. Why the outsides are grey and not e.g. the top-part of the body?

I like to avoid trying one display-driver after the other without getting a succes and like therefore understand a bit more of the problem. Can it be easy explained?

Thanks for any help.

Regards

Frank

Hi Frank!

Im the developer of that aircraft. The issue you describe happens here the first time at all.

What I can see from the screenshots, the reflective channel on some surfaces are not rendered. And the second fact, its seems only exterior faces are effected.

Third fact is, that normally the files included in the package are all the same for the costumers. And I dont know of a second time where this happened, so normally we can rule out so errors inside the download package.

I really tend to say its a hardware related thing. Somehow your system not wants to display the reflective textures.

To get sure you own all textures needed here my folder list for both aircraft texture directories H1A and H1B, so short- and longwinged version.

Try to sort out for now if there is something missing. Normally it should not, but we can never rule out machines do sometimes strange things.

[Frank-P 0]

Hi Capitain:-),

thanks for your help!

I checked the files in both folders on my computer. All files of your list are available. No one is missing. That is at least a good news:-)

If it is a hardware problem I wonder why other planes do not suffer this problem. The P51D from the acceleration package looks normal when choosen with a metallic livery, no matter which view is choosen. The 'FCS_Lockheed L10 Electra' from "Around the world in 80 flights" looks as expected and it uses a lot of metallic reflections for the body, too.

I do not know enough to be able to compare the different dds-files myself. As far as I know there exists different compression-standards for textures supported by the FSX. Do all textures of the H1-A/B use the same type of compression? Is this the most often choosen type or are there many different possibilities?

What makes me wonder is the fact, that some textures are displayed correct and other textures all the time not (as far noticed). If it would be an display-engine-hardware problem I would expect different textures from time to time displayed not as expected. Until know I did not recognize a problem like that. It is all the time only the body and a small part of the wings and tail of the H1-B or H1-A plane where I noticed this problem, not anywhere else. And further on this is permanent (as far as I noticed it until now).

It would be interesting if someone else is using a H1-B in FSX with a EN8800 from ASUS, which is a GTS 8800 nvidea with 640 MByte, and has no problems. Further on which driver are in use (including BIOS of the graphic-card). Can anybody help with information?

May be there is a FSX problem, depending of the installation order of different packages. May be something changed a config-file which is changing something in the FSX modelling-engine?

Do you know which files are worth to compare their content?

Do you have a better idea of isolating the problem? (Please do not tell me to reinstall everything again. Thats to much work. I still hope for a more efficient way of solving the problem.)

Many thanks once again for your help!

Regards

Frank

PS: I checked several different planes (about 8 different ones) with metallic body parts in the preview (Grumman, Wilco A380, ...). Not one of these planes shows a problem with reflecting metallic body-parts. Only the H1-A/B. I do hard in believing of a hardware-problem. It must be something special with the H1-B, may be depending on something else, but just this plane:-(

[Frank-P 0]

Hi,

wow your plane looks really great!!! (And I love the sound:-) )

I found the "thing" creating the problem, but I do not really understand the reason. I'm using TrackIR when flying in the FSX. If I disable the head-tracking the plane is shown correct. A small amount of time, it is first dark grey, and than it refelects light and looks metallic. And it looks really fantastic:-)))

I'm using TrackIR Pro Software-Version: Version 4.1 Build 35

I will upgrade to Build 36 and post if it helps.

Thanks to everybody. It's nice to know not to be alone with a problem.

Thanks!!

Best regards

Frank

PS: Upgrade to Build 36 of Software 4.1 does not solve the problem. If TrackIR is activated the H1-B gets a display-problem:-(

[Shaun Fletcher 570]

Hello Frank,

Maybe you could take this up with the guys at TrackIR and mention this particular issue.

[Frank-P 0]

Hello Shaun,

I'm afraid that would make no sense. The FSX uses the interface TrackIR offers. This interface is used in FSX all the time the same way. I do not think, that TrackIR can do anything which is related to the display-engine of the FSX. All planes do fine in FSX, just the Hughes H1-B does interfer with the display-engine in FSX. I think it is a bug in FSX how the TrackIR-Interface is handled in special situations. Therefore the only chance to solve the problem is to change the way the textures are handled in the H1-B, isn't it? It seems to be something special how iextures are handled by the H1-B, wrong? I did not look up the API of the TrackIR-software, but I did a lot of programming myself with asynchron working interfaces. There is almost no way fixing this, as far I understand the interaction between FSX and the TrackIR-Software, in the TrackIR-software.

Do you have any idea what is handled different with H1-B than with other planes regarding the texture-handling? What is different? What would make sense to ask the TrackIR-people in your opinion? All other planes work fine. (I did not see any failures with the PDMG 747 or the Piper PA 31T, if it would have something to do with the number of textures.)

Did I understand something wrong? Do I have a chance solving this problem by open a defect at TrackIR side? Might it be not more effective if the experts talk face to face, instead of someone in the middle not knowing all facts?

I hoped the information of the conflict between the H1-B and TrackIR may help to reproduce the problem by your support people. Is the problem still a very special, only reproduceable at my installation?

Is there any chance to fix the problem in the Hughes H1-B software? Or will it stay incompatible to TrackIR as the FSX supports it, at least on my system:-( ?

Regards Frank

[Snave 466]

FWIW I see no such problems on my system with TrackIR and the H1-B, either using a GeForce 6600GT card or an ATI Radeon HD3650, in any of the more recent driver `flavours`. These are much more lowly cards than yours.

Unless others are seeing the same problem (unlikely, as the combination of card/aircraft/TrackIR is hardly unusual in simming circles) this would tend to lend credence to the suggestion that the problem is system-specific, in which case the solution lies elsewhere than with the developers of the aircraft.

I can't see how any of the addons you list as installed could uniquely affect the Hughes, so are there any other mods to FSX that you haven't mentioned? This at least cold eliminate the sim itself as being the problem, as the problem does seem to only happen with Track IR, which is why it is quite possible that the only solution to your problem might be found in conjunction with the developers of that product.

[Frank-P 0]

Hello Snave,

thank you very much for this information. That means I will try to find out, which further component may be involved in probably my specific display-problem.

I have connected to my FSX a Saitek Yoke pro, Saitek switch panel, Saitek pedals and an MS Side Winder FFB-joystick.

Addons for the FSX I have installed the ones mentioned above and some further planes: Carenado M20J, DHC-6 twin otter, the JustFlight free version Cessna 152 and Carenado 182 RG II

For getting a hint what is involved in the display-problem I choosed areas to fly where no addon should be involved. The FTX one time enabled, one time disabled.

I use most often the 3G-switch in the boot.ini. I tried disabling it to check if it has any influence.

I will try to disconnect further USB-hardware. May be some other interface is disturbing or interfering further on.

Regards

Frank

Update:

Disconnecting USB-devices did not change anything, BUT starting FSX, wait until the window opens where one can choose the planes, and than start the TrackIR software makes the difference. You are all right, I guess!

May be the H1-B does something a bit different or more than others plane, the main factor influencing the display-engine of the FSX, regarding the aspect of loading not all textures, seems to be the TrackIR-software, at least on my system.

I did a support request at naturalpoint. If I get any useful information I will post it here:-)

Thanks everybody

Regards

Frank

[Zgredd 21]

Hello!

Same problem here

Even when my TrackIR soft is off completly.

My graph. - GF GTX260, WinXP SP3, DX 9.0c (last ver.)

And no other problems with any addon

[Shaun Fletcher 570]

Hello Zgredd,

Maybe you'll also need to tinker around to see whats causing the issue, not to many people seem to be having this issue so more than likely a system related issue as the developer states.

[VulcanB2 5]

Which SP is install for FSX? I seem to recall this being an issue with the Gold release of FSX?

EDIT:

I have FSX with Acceleration package installed.

Oops - should have read closer.

Best regards,

Robin.

[Zgredd 21]

Hmm. I think the key is the memory. When i load some airfield with any aircraft, and then load Hughes (not to load in menu before), all textures are fine

[Frank-P 0]

Hi,

some weeks ago I emailed to the developer of the TrackIR-Software. They said, that they can't do anything about this specific problem. They do not have any idear what could be done different from their point of view. They mentioned, that there is a possibility of getting some more debug/trace information from the simmconnect-interface. I guess there are some tools coming with the SDK for the FSX. I did't check this anymore, because I found a work-around at least on my system.

But while checking my system I recogniced, that it makes a difference, at least on my system, which service-pack of the FSX is installed. With FSX and SP1 it seems to run without any problem. (Just checked two starts). With the acceleration-package installed the problem is all the time reproduceable on my system, as described before.

Did anyone check, if a SP1 and a "pure" SP2 for the FSX installed, not the acceleration-package, does create the problem, too?

On my system I installed first SP1 for the FSX and then the acceleration package.

[Zgredd 21]

It is not necessary to install SP1 if you are going to install Acceleration.

Have you tried my solution?

[Frank-P 0]

I've just tried your solution. I choosed the Extra 300, let the plane set at the aerport, switched the plane to the Hughes one, and your right, the plane is displayed correct. This solution seems to work, too. (Tried it once)

I did not try this way before, because I noticed that some planes react different loaded at startup or later while being allready at one airport.

You are right once more:-), it is not needed to install SP1 when installing acceleration-package. I just thought it might be interessting if the Hughe airplane is doing fine without accelration-package.

[Zgredd 21]

Good to hear all works fine now