EDDB V3 still very bumpy runways/taxiways

[flypapawings 2]

Hello everyone! I am specifically trying to reach out to @Sasareferring to this thread:

It seems like nothing has changed in EDDB V3 and MSFS 2024. Can you explain the status of this, since both links provided in the previous thread don't show any progress.

https://devsupport.flightsimulator.com/t/microsoft-flight-simulator-2024-devalpha/10243/21

https://devsupport.flightsimulator.com/t/terraforming-on-tin/3710

 

I am wondering if there is nothing that can be done from scenery and the only ways to fix this is to turn off photogrammetry or wait for Asobo to fix something that has been existing since ever photogrammetry has been introduced (according to the conversation every airport in photogrammetry areas should be affected then...??)

 

Thanks

 

[Rhinozherous 33]

And I am really curious if the 2020 version will get a fix anytime or if it is now abandoned? It is not usable in its current state!

[Sasa 957]

In reply to the above and @Ozzwald_GER's post here: link

 

The bug and the possible fix (=deactivating TIN!) behind this remain unchanged for both MSFS2020 and MSFS2024:

 

EDDB has a heightmap (imagine it a checkerboard pattern with elevations set at regular intervals) that shows the airport with its real world sloped terrain as there is quite a slope between both ends of the runway (this is also needed for the train tunnel entrances and other small details, but that's just a side-effect).

 

With a TIN underneath MSFS X does some wrong interpolations of the terrain. In case of EDDB not only that, the TIN there is of quite a bad quality adding bumps in the terrain where there shouldn't be any. See this screenshot of the south rwy without the addon's heightmap active. The runway does have a slope but not up and down like this:

 

Please login to display this image.

 

In regards to "why can others do it!?": It's an understandable question but in part comparing apples to pears. In case if EDDB:

 

• We have bad TIN
• Sloped runways that cannot be simply flattened unless we want to mess up the whole airport (the only fix that works for buggy TINs - everywhere). Flatten = putting the whole airport to exactly one elevation level.
• Other developers/airports suffer the same problem, it's not only EDDB. Example: link

 

I have raised this bug once again here (and linked @Ozzwald_GER's video there, thanks!):

https://devsupport.flightsimulator.com/t/exclude-tin-not-working-problems-with-terraforming/7322

 

Bests,

Sascha

[Sasa 957]

...and right in this minute there's been a reply from Asobo (source see link in my previous post):

"I checked our backlog, and we are already tracking this bug in MSFS2024, but I can’t provide an ETA at this time."

[flypapawings 2]

Hi @Sasathanks for the detailed feedback. Just double-checking: TIN means photogrammetry, or do we have the possibility to deactivate TIN while having photogrammetry buildings? 

 

I get your point. Not sure though how iniBuilds can state "Please note this scenery is not compatible with photogrammetry OFF. ", just to give an example what this means to customers. We have to turn the setting off and on for various airports and do have to remember doing so all the time. I know - not your fault.

 

Since this issue is already been tracked in the backlog while being discussed in the DEV forums, does it even make sense for customers to raise this in the regular forums to vote for it?? Or how can we put more weight on this? Probably also something that is more directed towards Asobo, but maybe you've got an idea.

 

Thanks again mate

[Sasa 957]

21 hours ago, flypapawings said:

Hi @Sasathanks for the detailed feedback. Just double-checking: TIN means photogrammetry, or do we have the possibility to deactivate TIN while having photogrammetry buildings? 

 

My apologies, I should have made that clear as both terms describe the same thing. Photogrammetry=TIN and vice versa.

 

21 hours ago, flypapawings said:

I get your point. Not sure though how iniBuilds can state "Please note this scenery is not compatible with photogrammetry OFF. ", just to give an example what this means to customers. We have to turn the setting off and on for various airports and do have to remember doing so all the time. I know - not your fault.

 

The root of it all lies in the buggy TIN I'm afraid to say. I do however do not entirely agree with iniBuilds' approach here as I feel that an addon should always attempt to work both with and without photogrammetry/TIN. That is our aim here and I will keep bugging Asobo in hopes this will be resolved.

 

21 hours ago, flypapawings said:

Since this issue is already been tracked in the backlog while being discussed in the DEV forums, does it even make sense for customers to raise this in the regular forums to vote for it?? Or how can we put more weight on this? Probably also something that is more directed towards Asobo, but maybe you've got an idea.

 

Not much you can do in the regular forums I assume as long as it only affects addon airports and the people reporting it should be able to point out what from the SDK exactly isn't working.

MS/Asobo airports do not tend to be affected to my knowledge but in theory they should have the ability to exclude areas from a TIN or update the actual elevation model underneath without having to use the limited terraforming polygons/rectangles us mere mortals are bound to using the SDK.

 

Bests,

Sascha

[flypapawings 2]

No need for apology  I just wanted to make sure I am not mixing up things here...

 

I absolutely agree with you. A scenery should not dictate the user how to set their settings. Anyway, this is now definitely Asobos call to take action and thank you for "keep bugging Asobo in hopes this will be resolved". We all hope this will be resolved sooner than later.

 

That said, if there's nothing us users can do on our end I am hoping Asobo listening to you developers. My fingers are crossed and I am happily looking forward to an update from you since we might not hear anything from them on the regular channels.

 

Best

Papa

[flypapawings 2]

I just started from 24R and must say it’s no different with photogrammetry turned off. But fun fact: flying the LUROS2A over Berlin I still recognized photogrammetry buildings. So I guess that means you need to clear your rolling cache every time you change this setting?? Will try again another day. 

[Sasa 957]

@EVERYONE

I now took the axe and flattened the whole thing, so the whole issue with the bumpy terrain will be gone with a fix coming in the next days.

 

Been trying different approaches, talked to people etc. the past 2 days but there is no way to make the detailed sloped terrain of the airport work in the current environment we have around both EDDB and the sim-engine. Luckily EDDB is a rather flat airport so that doesn't take away too much realism.

 

And I guess we all agree that flyability should always be above terrain details.

 

Bests,

Sascha

[Ozzwald_GER 3]

Thank you so much .... it doesnt make any fun right now...

 

 

@flypapawings 

As MSFS2024 is a complete Beta, the TIN Switch inside the Menu isnt working .... but instead of disabling it globally you can disable the package in the Content.xml file.... the Package is called 

To disable it, switch active="Activated" to active="UserDisabled" ... so the TIN Cities within the WU18 (Berlin, Potsdam, Karow, Salzburg and more) will be disabled, but all other TIN stays in the sim .... its the only way to get a "flat" runway... other options i tried was taking the msfs2020 wu18 package, disable berlin.bgl and put it inside the communityfrolder (different name!) did not make any remarkable difference 

 

<Package name="fs24-fs-base-coverage-map-germany2-tin" active="UserDisabled"/>

 

[flypapawings 2]

@Ozzwald_GERthanks! I wasn't aware of that switch not working properly. I will check and I am looking forward to the EDDB update.

I have seen the point "Fix photogrammetry not being disabled ingame when disabling photogrammetry package." in the SU1 changeling, though.

[mikkel 123]

Hope this gets resolved. I like TIN and I like realistic uneven grounds and I'm probably not alone 

 

[DerHorstmann 0]

@Sasawill there be an Update for the 2020 Version aswell so that we're not forced to turn off TIN when flying in and out of EDDB? Would be much appreciated.

[Rhinozherous 33]

vor 22 Stunden schrieb DerHorstmann:

@Sasawill there be an Update for the 2020 Version aswell so that we're not forced to turn off TIN when flying in and out of EDDB? Would be much appreciated.

I would LOVE to see this also for 2020.

[Ozzwald_GER 3]

@SASA there is a big bump (taxiing still works) when leaving 06L via L5

Please login to display this image.

[Sasa 957]

14 hours ago, Ozzwald_GER said:

@SASA there is a big bump (taxiing still works) when leaving 06L via L5

 

Looks like an area where the heightmap still had priority over the flatten. Apologies about that, on it...!

[Sasa 957]

On 3/8/2025 at 7:51 PM, DerHorstmann said:

@Sasawill there be an Update for the 2020 Version aswell so that we're not forced to turn off TIN when flying in and out of EDDB? Would be much appreciated.

 

That's a possibility for sure but first we need to be 100% sure this is working as intended in one simulator before porting this over to another sim.

Also keep in mind that the new features, like the new terminal airside modelling, are not planned to be ported over to MSFS2020 at this stage.

 

Bests,

Sascha

[DerHorstmann 0]

vor 10 Stunden schrieb Sasa:

 

That's a possibility for sure but first we need to be 100% sure this is working as intended in one simulator before porting this over to another sim.

Also keep in mind that the new features, like the new terminal airside modelling, are not planned to be ported over to MSFS2020 at this stage.

 

Bests,

Sascha

 

that's perfectly fine, at least for me, would just love to have a "bump-free" airport

 

regards

[flypapawings 2]

Did a flight from EGLL to EDDB landing on 24R last night. Everything went well and it was smooth like butter

Thanks again for the update  

[SWOOS 21]

Will be fixed this also?

 

Please login to display this image.

[Sasa 957]

19 hours ago, SWOOS said:

Will be fixed this also?

 

I'm afraid I cannot replicate this here. I have tried with and without TIN/photogrammetry:

Please login to display this image.

 

Please check in your content manager that you have the latest version (0.3.2) and that there are no other addons that could conflict.

 

I have also checked the terrain level of detail slider to see if it happens with other settings but still couldn't replicate this.

 

Bests,

Sascha

[Rhinozherous 33]

Can we still hope that EDDB for MSFS 2020 will also be flatened?

Thank you

[Sasa 957]

On 4/8/2025 at 6:56 PM, Rhinozherous said:

Can we still hope that EDDB for MSFS 2020 will also be flatened?

Thank you

 

Yes, I still have that on my list and it will be done, though I cannot tell exactly when. Meanwhile the recommendation remains to use it without photogrammetry/TIN active in MSFS2020.

In any case it will only be a bugfix for the bumpy terrain. All the new features like higher resolution ground textures, new airside modelling etc. will only be available in the MSFS2024 version, which will is currently planned to remain free for buyers of the MSFS2020 version (and vice versa).

 

Bests,

Sascha

[Sasa 957]

@Rhinozherous

Was was about to work on it today but it seems that MS/Asobo fixed the underlying problem with photogrammetry/TIN meanwhile? That being said I taxied up and down the whole airport and up and down the runways and couldn't encounter any considerable bumps using the default A320.

Would be good to see it resolved this way and that flattening the whole airport wouldn't be needed anymore.

 

Bests,

Sascha