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Problem with CRJ1000 on takeoff


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Hello,

 

I've got some trouble when taking off with the CRJ1000 in MSFS. After planning a flight with Simbrief I set all weights and fuel in the EFB, load the aircraft and calculate the Vref speeds in the EFB.

When reaching Vr no matter how far I pull the yoke back nothing happens. Around V2+10 the aircraft nose instantly pops up into the air so a soft rotation is not possible. I already tried different setups from MTOW to completely empty, different flap settings etc. It's always the same. And yes, the Vref speeds and trim setting is correctly set into the aircraft as the EFB calculated them.

All other aircrafts of the CRJ family are rotating fine as expected, only the 1000 makes trouble and seems to be unflyable.

If needed I'll try to provide a video of the problem.

Any suggestions what might me wrong or maybe anyone else got the same issue?

 

Thanks in advance!

Christopher

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Hello,

 

You also need to set the CG in the FS W/B menu to 35 exactly, every flight...

You don't see it too much on the others because their default CG is closer or higher than 35, in the 1000, it's 31 default from memory.

 

i hope AS could also do something about it, it's quite cumbersome ...

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Thanks for your reply. I don't know if I did something wrong but that doesn't work for me. The plane is still unflyable.

Do you just change the slider to 35 and then load the aircraft via the EFB?

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yep, once loaded on the gate, i set the CG to 35, then proceed to setup the plane all throught the EFB.

the plane start rotating smoothly at about vr+5 for me with quite alot of back stick, once the plane start rotating i release to less than half back stick, and get a smooth takeoff, i don't know if it"s realistic or not, hard to compare the deflection with videos as we don't know the load and so on.

but for sure if i do not set the CG to 35 like in the manual, full back stick the plane start rotating at like 170 - 180 ...

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Ooops, didn't know that this is hided there... thanks for the hint!
One last question. If I set the payload in the EFB and click on SET PAYLOAD IN SIMULATOR the aircraft will be loaded and the CG runs to a specific point. If I click the button again nothing in weight or fuel changes but the CG instantly moves to a different point!

And that's exactly the problem. I just tried it, load the aircraft with just one click I can rotate the plane exactly as expected and very smooth. If I click twice where the CG shift to a strange position the plane isn't flyable anymore. Maybe Aerosoft can fix this issue, I'll open a ticket on this.

So on the first picture the plane is loaded with the correct CG and flies smooth, on the second pic you see the same payload with a wrong CG and that's what makes rotating nearly impossible.

 

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That's odd because it's always required me to press load twice.  The first time I end up with a weird loading, the second stabilizes it and after that I can repeatedly load it to my heart's content and it never changes.

 

I've always just assumed it was just another quirk and never questioned it.

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10 hours ago, Joe Markowski said:

That's odd because it's always required me to press load twice.  The first time I end up with a weird loading, the second stabilizes it and after that I can repeatedly load it to my heart's content and it never changes.

 

I've always just assumed it was just another quirk and never questioned it.

It's been that way since the CRJ's FSX days. I'm not sure why it does that, or why we need to do it twice. I just remember I have to do it twice.

 

Aerosoft, this seems like an easy thing to fix, just fix it for god's sake.

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@Himbi there are tons of topics regarding how to properly set up W/B with the CRJ (I will repeat the key points for you).

1. Never, and I mean never, set W/B of the CRJ through the W/B window from MSFS! --> W/B are only set through the EFB!

2. Never touch the Empty CG from the W/B window of MSFS

3. Don't even look to the W/B screen in MSFS --> only use the EFB

4. After setting up W/B in the EFB press twice to send the data to the SIM (this has also been explaind mamy times before why it is requiered).

 

Regards

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2 hours ago, GEK_the_Reaper said:

2. Never touch the Empty CG from the W/B window of MSFS

i'm sorry but the manual clearly state to put the empty CG at 35

 

in the 1000 if you don't do it, u just can't rotate before 180-200kts ....

 

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Am 16.1.2023 um 17:54 schrieb Muds:

i'm sorry but the manual clearly state to put the empty CG at 35

Unfortunately the manual is older and refers to an older version of MSFS! Do not touch it!

 

Addition 1:

The picture in the manual shows the slider for the CRJ700 fully to the right coresponding to a empty CG of 35 -> this is OLD. Load the CRJ700 and if you move the slider completely to the right you will get other numbers for the empty CG

 

Addition 2 (THIS IS IMPORTANT TO BE UNDERSTOOD): The empty CG is not a value that changes with your weight and balance (it is the EMPTY CG). This value comes programmed in the airframe data. Changing it will result in ....yeah...

 

Addition 3: If you somehow changed the empty CG please revert the values to default (I'm not sure if the chages are saved).

Standards are:

CRJ550 -> 36,5

CRJ700 -> 37,0

CRJ900 -> 36,0

CRJ1000-> 31,2

 

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and start with a default aircract b4 zelecting the crj. then start the crj from cold and dark. it does make a differece. the rotation is much smoother. after gear up add more trim

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Well the CRJ900 actually works good but the 1000 still makes trouble. I selected the aircraft, load it from cold and dark, loaded it via EFB, set the trim correctly but takeoff is still a mess. At VR I pull the yoke all the way back to maximum and nothing happens. And then around V2 the nose pops up.

 

I think I'm done with this aircraft. Will stick with the 550/700 and 900...

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  • 2 weeks later...

Just tried again a "very heavy" 1000, at Vr full yoke back nothing happens. At V2+10 the nose slowly starts rising and then pops into the air. That's not as it is supposed to be.

Btw I loaded the plane via the EFB to ~41300kg TOW and the green dot which shows the CG(?) moved outside the chart! I thing this isn't correct either...

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Am 31.1.2023 um 19:57 schrieb Himbi:

Just tried again a "very heavy" 1000, at Vr full yoke back nothing happens. At V2+10 the nose slowly starts rising and then pops into the air. That's not as it is supposed to be.

Btw I loaded the plane via the EFB to ~41300kg TOW and the green dot which shows the CG(?) moved outside the chart! I thing this isn't correct either...

 

Dear @Himbi,

 

with a TOW of 41300 kg you would have been exceeding the MZFW of 35154Kg...of course you will be outside the envelope and have a ton of issues flying the aircraft.

 

Loading the C1000 with 84 PASS, Max FWD and AFT Cargo and 4500Kg of Fuel is the Max  load that you can put in the CRJ.

Taking Max PASS (104) would mean that you have to reduce payload of both cargo bays in such a manner that the DOT stays within the flight envelope (GREEN).

 

I wouild recomend to study / understand this aircraft if you want to fly it!

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Well, if a TOW of 41300kg is too much in your opinion, why does the EFB shows a MTOW of 41640kg? Doesn't make sense.

 

As I plan my flights with SimBrief I usually load a plane via setting just the ZFW and fuel. This works in every addon fine, I know how to load an aircraft, don't worry.

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vor 14 Stunden schrieb Himbi:

I know how to load an aircraft, don't worry.

Well I do worry because the ZERO FUEL WEIGHT is something else then the TOW (which includes the fuel).

 

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Am 31.1.2023 um 19:57 schrieb Himbi:

Btw I loaded the plane via the EFB to ~41300kg TOW

Did I wrote ZFW? No. TOW!

 

vor einer Stunde schrieb GEK_the_Reaper:

Here a Video with max loads with a perfect Rotation and TO from LOWI (FLEX TEMP also applied).

That wasn't a perfect rotation either. Your nose pops into the air after V2, like it is in my sim.

A 'perfect' rotation looks more like this in my opinion. Just compare the rotation speed how the nose lifts up into the air. https://youtu.be/DAUQTfUKfQg?t=50

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