Still turning too early and "hunting" after sharp turns in flightplan?

[flyinion 11]

Just did a flight from LFKJ to LFKB with the following route  LIBLO L146 BTA LIBL5S  to RNAV16 approach.  The end of the LIBL5S is about a 180 degree turn to the last waypoint which is the first waypoint of the approach as well.  When the plane got to the start it turned way too sharp and was facing the correct direction but way to the left of the proper course and I had to quickly correct "as usual" with heading instead.  I was hoping this kind of behavior would be fixed in the last two updates this week but I guess not?  This is the only plane in the sim that seems to have this issue.  To its credit it did handle the around 80 degree turn from the RWY 2 heading at LIBLO without issue though.  Should I be turning on a bank limiter or something on approaches?

[Saffa_Jake 8]

This may be why > LINK

[JRBarrett 675]

11 hours ago, flyinion said:

Just did a flight from LFKJ to LFKB with the following route  LIBLO L146 BTA LIBL5S  to RNAV16 approach.  The end of the LIBL5S is about a 180 degree turn to the last waypoint which is the first waypoint of the approach as well.  When the plane got to the start it turned way too sharp and was facing the correct direction but way to the left of the proper course and I had to quickly correct "as usual" with heading instead.  I was hoping this kind of behavior would be fixed in the last two updates this week but I guess not?  This is the only plane in the sim that seems to have this issue.  To its credit it did handle the around 80 degree turn from the RWY 2 heading at LIBLO without issue though.  Should I be turning on a bank limiter or something on approaches?

The real CRJ is not capable of doing an RNP approach. They will appear in the nav database of the sim version, and although (in general) RNP procedures are not supported in the sim FMS (use at your own risk), this particular one should work, as it contains no complex RF legs.
 

However, I don’t think the problem you are reporting is caused by the RNP approach itself.

 

I assume the issue you are seeing is related to the 218 degree left turn from D21.0 BTA to CAPCO. The real CRJ autopilot can use two bank angles when turning - either 15 degrees or 30 degrees. Above 31,600 feet it will use only 15 degrees (and the words “1/2 Bank” will appear on the FMA) Below 31,600 feet it normally banks at 30 degrees, but will use 15 degrees if appropriate. It might change from 30 to 15 degrees mid-turn if it “sees” that it is turning too quickly and might overshoot next waypoint. When this happens the “1/2 Bank” message will not illuminate.
 

Unfortunately in the sim, the autopilot will only use 30 degree bank below 31,600 feet. In this particular STAR , with a 218 degree course reversal, a shallow bank might be more appropriate. You can do one of two things: While outbound on the BTA 25 degree radial to 21.0 BTA, sync your heading bug to your current heading, go to HDG mode on the autopilot momentarily, then press the autopilot 1/2 BANK button and finally press the NAV button again. This will force the autopilot to use a 15 degree bank for the turn to CAPCO, which might work better. 
 

Alternatively, go to HDG mode at D21.0 BTA, and do the left turn to CAPCO manually, then re-enable NAV

 

Even the real CRJ autopilot can have problems doing a significant course change over a short distance when part of an FMS procedure, and sometimes pilots will have to help it out by reverting to HDG mode or even hand-flying if necessary. This is also the case in the real aircraft when intercepting an ILS localizer at a sharp angle (like 90 degrees)

[Matthew2312 95]

1 hour ago, JRBarrett said:

The real CRJ is not capable of doing an RNP approach. They will appear in the nav database of the sim version, and although (in general) RNP procedures are not supported in the sim FMS (use at your own risk), this particular one should work, as it contains no complex RF legs.
 

However, I don’t think the problem you are reporting is caused by the RNP approach itself.

 

I assume the issue you are seeing is related to the 218 degree left turn from D21.0 BTA to CAPCO. The real CRJ autopilot can use two bank angles when turning - either 15 degrees or 30 degrees. Above 31,600 feet it will use only 15 degrees (and the words “1/2 Bank” will appear on the FMA) Below 31,600 feet it normally banks at 30 degrees, but will use 15 degrees if appropriate. It might change from 30 to 15 degrees mid-turn if it “sees” that it is turning too quickly and might overshoot next waypoint. When this happens the “1/2 Bank” message will not illuminate.
 

Unfortunately in the sim, the autopilot will only use 30 degree bank below 31,600 feet. In this particular STAR , with a 218 degree course reversal, a shallow bank might be more appropriate. You can do one of two things: While outbound on the BTA 25 degree radial to 21.0 BTA, sync your heading bug to your current heading, go to HDG mode on the autopilot momentarily, then press the autopilot 1/2 BANK button and finally press the NAV button again. This will force the autopilot to use a 15 degree bank for the turn to CAPCO, which might work better. 
 

Alternatively, go to HDG mode at D21.0 BTA, and do the left turn to CAPCO manually, then re-enable NAV

 

Even the real CRJ autopilot can have problems doing a significant course change over a short distance when part of an FMS procedure, and sometimes pilots will have to help it out by reverting to HDG mode or even hand-flying if necessary. This is also the case in the real aircraft when intercepting an ILS localizer at a sharp angle (like 90 degrees)

Heck, George struggles with a 30 degree intercept from time to time. The amount of times I’ve had to be asked about a localizer overshoot when running parallel approaches in that jet.

[flyinion 11]

Thanks for the bank info. I’ll try the half bank next time.  Yeah I saw the RNP thing. Kinda disappointing on that. Didn’t realize it actually couldn’t handle them and assumed it could. Lol I was all happy to have a second plane besides the freeware CJ4 mod that I could use with navigraph data and not have to pick runways with ILS in some cases. That’s ok it will just force me to not rely on autopilot as much for approach. Altitude issues aside on the approach in this case (came in way too high) I also found out the last leg before the runway is offset but it was very easy to maneuver the plane to line up. So I’m definitely looking forward to a lot more trips in it now that all these fixes are in.