Performance Bug or User Error?? Running out of airspeed, altitude, and ideas all at the same time! Please help...

[KevyKevTPA 29]

OK, I'm not sure if I've got a bug here, or if I'm doing something wrong, or perhaps it's even both.  Please take a look at the attached video, the audio sucks so I'll basically repeat what I was saying...

 

I was in cruise on autopilot, and for a while things were fine.  But then the plane (the 700 variant) started doing s-turns across the flight route, the speed was decreasing rapidly despite being at max power, with the APU running, and no ice on the airframe, or deicing activated.  Before taxi, I checked the CG, and it was in the envelope, but as you can see, the crosshairs are showing a massive out of balance situation aft, while at the same time, the number shown seems to be accurate.  Most of the perf init values came from simbrief (# of passengers, amount of fuel required), but while it was in the W&B envelope, I manually adjusted the cargo to put it more in the envelope (towards the front of the aircraft) as I was a little uncomfortable being  as far aft as it originally was.

 

I manually terminated the flight, as I wanted to get this posted while everything was completely fresh in my mind.

 

Something similar happened yesterday, but I was in the 500 variant, and in that case, I disconnected the autopilot to get the speed under control, settled on a cruise at FL250, and reengaged the autopilot which resulted in a relatively drama free conclusion of the flight, including properly tracking the GS.  But I did nail the parameters at GS intercept, speed, config, you name it, so that probably helped.  I don't have any video or pics of that flight.  I do have a picture of the EFB from the flight in the video, and will be happy to supply it, but it only shows what's already in the video, though probably offset by a minute or two.

 

The flight plan (in both flights) was:  KMCO/18R MCOY2 GUANO DCT FEMON Q87 VIYAP Q69 GURGE DCT PETTO DCT JURDI MALNR5 KRDU/23R

 

Last night I had winds aloft in excess of 100 kts, so I thought that may have contributed, but they were more "normal" today.  (In the 80s.)

 

For what it's worth, I am an instrument rated private pilot IRL, but haven't flown in more years than I care to admit, but nonetheless find those skills helpful at times when simming.  But I've never even seen a CRJ in reality, much less flown one.

 

So, if anyone has any questions, or would like any additional information, just let me know!  I do understand that flying in icing conditions has been known to cause performance issues like this, but whatever happened here, it wasn't ice.

 

And with that, I turn it over to you guys, the Aerosoft community, to hopefully help me figure out what's going on.  Oh, and yes, I flew the tutorial flight.  Several times.  Once with a video from BobbyFuzzy playing on my TV which I found particularly helpful.  It's not related to this, but he also helped me diagnose why my parking brake mapping was only sometimes working.  (It was because of the chocks...)

 

And....  GO!!

 

 

Please login to view this video.

[Aplato 133]

I'm not sure about the speed issue, but I can comment on two of the others:

1. There is a bug with either the aircraft or the sim that causes you to click the button to load fuel based on your settings twice. Whenever I do that at least I notice the cross-hairs move to the correct location. I'm not sure exactly what happens if you only click it once but I don't believe it's the correct behavior.
2. The S-turns is a commonly reported issue that the Aerosoft team is already reviewing.

As for the speed, do you recall if you clicked escape to load the menu at any  point during your flight? I believe there is a bug that causes the sim to believe the spoilers have been deployed when that happens even if all indications are that they are retracted.

[KevyKevTPA 29]

32 minutes ago, Aplato said:

• There is a bug with either the aircraft or the sim that causes you to click the button to load fuel based on your settings twice. Whenever I do that at least I notice the cross-hairs move to the correct location. I'm not sure exactly what happens if you only click it once but I don't believe it's the correct behavior.
• The S-turns is a commonly reported issue that the Aerosoft team is already reviewing.

 

Well, hopefully the right person will see my video and perhaps it can contribute to them finding and/or implementing a fix on both counts.

 

33 minutes ago, Aplato said:

As for the speed, do you recall if you clicked escape to load the menu at any  point during your flight? I believe there is a bug that causes the sim to believe the spoilers have been deployed when that happens even if all indications are that they are retracted.

 

I did, but it was way before I took off, and I'm 99.999% sure I corrected the issue with the spoilers as I'm fully aware of the bug and it's effects.  And after doing so, I took off, climbed to FL390 at the right speed and what seems to be a superb rate of climb, and cruised for quite some time until the wheels came off.  I don't think any of that would have been possible had my spoilers been stealth deployed.  Now, that doesn't at all mean that Asobo doesn't need to fix that bug and fix it fast, they do!  But I don't think that was an issue in this case.

 

I'm not at all surprised that I didn't find anything new, because it was so easy to find I can't have been the first.  But hopefully at least one small detail from my video or experience might help inspire an aha moment in the people who know far more about the topic of fixing this stuff than I do.  It would be very nice to think I was able to contribute something, no matter how little, to such an amazing project.

[Dave March 24]

If your wheels fell off you need to start a new topic!

 

(Sorry, couldn't resist that one!) 

[DGH 0]

Had the same speed issue and it is NOT the spoiler thing ( for me )

 

almost stalling at 370 … and only started to drop after one hour cruise with no issue.

 

no clouds … no ice warning … no ice on plane … de-icing ON … NO change at FL370

 

decending to 350 … speed picking up … NO issue at 350. So that confirms the spoiler issue is bot happening otherwise it would continue at 350.

Looks like ice … but there is no ice

 

second flight this happened. First time i just dropped to FL290 from FL350. Also solved.

 

 

[KevyKevTPA 29]

38 minutes ago, Dave March said:

If your wheels fell off you need to start a new topic!

 

Hmm.  Well, considering I'm stuck in a wheelchair, I probably would start a new topic, yes LOL.  Not here, but somewhere!  But aside from that (which you couldn't possibly have known unless you recognize my name from elsewhere online), I really must claim ignorance as I'm not sure what you mean by your question?

 

I'm a total noob to these forums, in the event it's a relatively common expression here...

 

Thanks!

[Dave March 24]

Sorry, I didn't ask a question, just my silly humour.

[KevyKevTPA 29]

1 minute ago, Dave March said:

Sorry, I didn't ask a question, just my silly humour.

 

Roger that.

 

Hopefully someone from Aerosoft will be along in the short term future to perhaps add some insight as to what might have happened here.  If nothing else, perhaps an explanation why it happened on this particular flight (in both variants), because I have had other flights that did not encounter these issues.  Other problems, sure, but those were in between my ears, not related to any issues with the aircraft.  But at least I'm getting to the point that (most) of my landings are pretty decent, at least if my approach was stabilized.  And sometimes even if it wasn't, which is where those real world flying skills (and using VR for a better sight window) come into play.  I told a good friend of mine that I was flying it like a 172 from my training days, and I really was.  Flying visually, pitch for altitude, power for airspeed (which after awhile becomes so ingrained that you don't even have to think about it, even after all these years), albeit with a little delay on the power due to it being a turbojet, aim for the marker and plant it!  Gently, of course.

 

But never forget, a good landing is one that you can walk away from, and a great one is one in which you can use the airplane again!

 

PS...  What are your books about?  I even tried using google with no help.  And no, I'm not stalking you, I was just curious about the books LOL...

[LederhosenCharly 7]

same problem i wrote in nearly 5 threads now - trimming is up 15 way out of the comfort range... really weird selftrimming with speed and nav mode engaged - it happens in 1 out of 10 flights, and it must be a bug - really strange...

[Dave March 24]

I was once told provided your landings are equal to your takeoffs then you're doing okay!

 

Books? Ah, the 'Author' tag below my signature. I'm not sure where that resides and have tried to remove it, to no avails. Anyway, they're not books. FDC (Flight Deck Companion) was one of my original programs for FS, released in 2001, and eventually published by Aerosoft. In fact it's still available from Aerosoft and renamed FDC Live Cockpit. PFE (Proflight Emulator) was originally my attempt to bring back and enhance the ATC program Proflight 2000, first released in 2007. Since then it has undergone huge changes and today is a complete standalone ATC program for FS9, FSX, P3D and of course MSFS and called PF3.

 

Didn't mean to get into self promoting my wares, but you did ask.

[Secondator 643]

Hello KevyKenTPA,

What was approximately your weight at the time this issue happened? You seem to be trying to cruise at FL390. The CRJ performance isn't excellent at very high altitudes as it was designed for mostly short flights.

Also it was already mentioned but check if you have any spoiler axis assignments. Currently they don't really work correctly and if you enter the ESC menu the sim might give you full spoilers aerodynamically from your axis even though there are no signs of this happening inside the sim itself other than you just have a lot of extra drag.

[Peterwk10 0]

Hi,

 

I had a similar experience on my first test flight yesterday.  I was cruising at 36000 ft and all of a sudden the airspeed dropped and the engine N1 speed was wildly fluctuating (70-95%) without me moving my throttles.  The airspeed started to reduce and even with the throttles set to TOGA is was only achieving 180 knots.  Fortunately, I had reached the point where I had to descend anyway and I managed to complete my flight.

I did leave the flight to update my graphics settings.  I suspect that the problems started after I resumed the flight.  That would account for the "phantom spoiler" issue but not the engine fluctuations.

 

Best regards,

 

Peter Keenan

[KevyKevTPA 29]

Someone asked about my weight, so I thought this pic might be helpful.  I thought the vid captured this, but I don't think it really did so very well.  This was taken right before I started filming the above video.  (You ever wonder why we still say "filming" when none of us have seen film for decades?)

 

Please login to display this image.

[KevyKevTPA 29]

Oh, and as to the "why" I was flying so high, that's what simbrief recommended.  But I suspect they need a specific model for these aircraft, not just some generic thing that has the same name.

[wafu 1]

use standard Payload

 

and press 2x Set payload in simulator

 

 

[Peterwk10 0]

Hi,

 

I had  the same problem again.  Cruising with no problem, then about an hour into the flight, the airspeed suddenly increased and then it just decreased down to 140 knots at 30000 ft with the engines at the maximum speed.

 

Somethings nor right here obviously.

 

Best regards,

 

Peter

 

 

[Peterwk10 0]

Hi,

 

I was watching a YouTube by the Sim Pilot "Microsoft Flight Simulator 2020 | SUNDAY STREAM" on April 11 and he had  exactly the same problem about an hour into the stream.

 

Best regards,

 

Peter

[JonasN1985 1]

Same problem with me - last time yesterday. Normal flight conditions, FL320. Didn't even managed to capture the altitude. Loss of thrust and climbing abilities. Followed all tweaks and tips.

[Peterwk10 0]

Hi,

 

I was watching a YouTube by the Sim Pilot "Microsoft Flight Simulator 2020 | SUNDAY STREAM" on April 11 and he had  exactly the same problem about an hour into the stream.

 

Best regards,

 

Peter

[Peterwk10 0]

Hi,

 

Feedback on my latest flight.

 

The issue seems to be with the flight spoilers.  They seem to be activated randomly and when looking at the outside view, there were no signs that they were extended.

 

When I was taking off, I had a take-off config warning - flight spoilers deployed.  However the spoilers were fully retracted.  I cycled my airbrake lever a couple of times and then the warning went away.

 

During the approach, I had the messages a few times flight spoilers deployed and eventually managed to clear them by pressing the "/" button.  

 

Then on the final approach, the warning came up again.

 

Throughout the flight I had not touched the airbrake lever on my CH throttle quadrant apart from clearing off the spurious messages.

 

Best regards,

 

Peter

[bluemoon51 214]

Hi All

 

I had an issue that sounded very much like this, a flight from KBIL going upto CYVR with a cruising altitude of FL360 no icing reported yesterday and I turned icing off in the sim for today's flight 1hour in without any kind of warning after having flown at cruise for 30mins or so with no change to any of the readings the aircraft could no longer maintain speed or altitude. I assumed yesterday it was something to do with ice conditions(although no warning to suggest that), so today even with icing turned off in the sim I left all my deicing on, but it "failed" at almost the same spot in the flight.

[metzgergva 210]

9 hours ago, Peterwk10 said:

Hi,

 

Feedback on my latest flight.

 

The issue seems to be with the flight spoilers.  They seem to be activated randomly and when looking at the outside view, there were no signs that they were extended.

 

When I was taking off, I had a take-off config warning - flight spoilers deployed.  However the spoilers were fully retracted.  I cycled my airbrake lever a couple of times and then the warning went away.

 

During the approach, I had the messages a few times flight spoilers deployed and eventually managed to clear them by pressing the "/" button.  

 

Then on the final approach, the warning came up again.

 

Throughout the flight I had not touched the airbrake lever on my CH throttle quadrant apart from clearing off the spurious messages.

 

Best regards,

 

Peter

In the current version of MSFS using ESC does deploy the spoiler function. Also make sure you are not having assigned the spoiler axis to any lever.

[Peterwk10 0]

Hi,

 

Many thanks for your reply.

 

Just to say that I didn't press ESC at all on my last flight.

 

Also, may I ask why I should assign the spoiler axis to any lever?  This is normally what I do, using FSUIPC to do this.

 

Best regards,

 

Peter

 

[Dave March 24]

I've also experienced this issue with the CRJ but yesterday I was flying the default MSFS ICON A5, hit ESC for something and when returning to the aircraft the power had dropped by 50%. Easy enough to get things back to normal by cutting the throttle then pushing it forward again. So I'm assuming this is more an MSFS issue than it is a CRJ problem.

[Puuhbear 114]

vor 1 hour , Peterwk10 sagte:

Hi,

 

Many thanks for your reply.

 

Just to say that I didn't press ESC at all on my last flight.

 

Also, may I ask why I should assign the spoiler axis to any lever?  This is normally what I do, using FSUIPC to do this.

 

Best regards,

 

Peter

 

You should „not“! 
 

there is an issue with mikroinputs from levers assigned to the spoiler axis.