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Aircraft Lifts Off On It's Own


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Is it possible the CG is out of whack? I also noticed weird high angles of attack in addition to the early nose-lift on takeoff.

 

I've set the weights by entering the ZFW in the EFB. And according to the EFB my ZFW CG is 18.4%. CG for takeoff 19.1. And I think that's fine.

But according to FS20's fuel tab the Center of gravity is at 23.84%. (empty position 35 full to the right as it should be). I didn't touch the FS weights when setting up.

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7 minutes ago, flycln said:

Is it possible the CG is out of whack? I also noticed weird high angles of attack in addition to the early nose-lift on takeoff.

 

I've set the weights by entering the ZFW in the EFB. And according to the EFB my ZFW CG is 18.4%. CG for takeoff 19.1. And I think that's fine.

But according to FS20's fuel tab the Center of gravity is at 23.84%. (empty position 35 full to the right as it should be). I didn't touch the FS weights when setting up.

If you did transfer the data from the EFB that should be identical on fuele and load weight and very close on % COG.

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8 minutes ago, flyingguitaristsam said:

Y is pitch. I'll continue to try different settings with this

I'm using the default -30% so this is okay.

could you check the CoG displayed in the EFB with what you have in the MSFS load UI?

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I just did 3 take-offs withndefault load and trim at 7.1. Verified CoG and fuel is identical in sim as in EFB.

If I do nothing, the plane very slowly lifts the nose at 160 kts.

If I want to rotate at Vr=134 I need to pull my yoke about 8% of travel.

 

Sorry it is different at your side and my suggestion is to either push a bit fwd or use a lower trim unit.

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vor 30 Minuten, metzgergva sagte:

If you did transfer the data from the EFB that should be identical on fuele and load weight and very close on % COG.

I did.

 

What I did for takeoff was to enter the ZFW and the fuel in the EFB and then hit "Set Payload in Simulator". The EFB calculated it and gave me a CG of 19%. The fuel tab of the sim instead said it's 23%.

 

Now get this: I hit the same "set payload in simulator" button again after landing, the ZFW and fuel were still in obviously: and now the EFB gave me a CG of 23%.

 

Do you have to hit that twice or a random amount of times to get it right? 😛 I remember the CRJ in P3D also behaved a little erratically depending on whether you hit "Set payload" once or twice at some point.

 

(on a side note: i love how some of the bugs from the P3D version are carried over to the FS20 version. The LNAV still enjoys hunting the course after overshooting.)

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Vor 1 Stunde, metzgergva sagte:

That at least would explain the easy rotation. Does the recommended trim stay at 7.1?

Nope, it was more reasonable when I clicked it again after landing. 6.5 it was (from memory). I assume that would have resulted in a normal rotation.

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there seem to be some synching problem and if I reload the plane I get sometime the CoG to full left....

Anyhow I will work on finding a better rotation behaviour with the data calculated from the EFB. Will require to check with the UI just to be sure.

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Here's what I've noticed regarding using the EFB to load the weight and balance.
After entering all the info before departure pressing "set payload in simulator" once comes up with a range of values, but if you press it again then it comes up with totally different ones. Repeated presses seem to keep with the second set of values from the second press.

I suspect that the initial single press for some reason is not setting the weight, balance and trim properly (I've also only been using the set ZFW option rather than loading each section independently, so perhaps this only occurs when you use the EFB this way). I have been pressing the send button multiple times and have had no issues with a proper rotation.

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I can confirm the problem is caused by the efb sending incorrect data.  It is not sending the correct pax and cargo weights throwing the CG off.  When I move the slider to match the efb takeoff weight and manually enter the cargo weights the airplane behaves normally.   It was setting a very low fwd cargo weight making the plane want to sit on its tail.

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VERY IMPORTANT: The CoG Slider should always bee at the very right 35% postion. Do not use it!

If you want to have different loads, the EFB should be doing this and we need to find out on the cases it does not. 
The load slider in the UI is not useful either as it simply distributes in to any load station the SAME value. So the flight attendants position get loaded with multiple persons.

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And the CoG in the EFB is the same as in the UI and the TOW is correct to in both?

If you still get too early nose lift, reduce the Trim value by 0.5 or 1.0. and see if that helps as intermediate solution.

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i can confirm this occurs when only pressing the "set payload in simulator" once. when i click it at least twice, everything works more or less as expected. this problem is further exacerbated by the fact that there is no visual feedback if the button click was successful. 

 

so:

- fix the bug that the payload has to be set twice to make the CG work properly

- make a button-pressed visual state so you can easily tell when the button click was accepted, this also goes for the v-speed buttons especially

 

also kind of related: the plane comes off the ground very easily but right after takeoff, you need to add a LOOOT of back elevator to keep it pitching up towards the FD horizontal bars. this also feels quite odd, maybe there's a bug there as well

 

 

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1 minute ago, tksr said:

also kind of related: the plane comes off the ground very easily but right after takeoff, you need to add a LOOOT of back elevator to keep it pitching up towards the FD horizontal bars. this also feels quite odd, maybe there's a bug there as well

 

I'm working on this right now to become better...

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27 minutes ago, tksr said:

i can confirm this occurs when only pressing the "set payload in simulator" once. when i click it at least twice, everything works more or less as expected. this problem is further exacerbated by the fact that there is no visual feedback if the button click was successful. 

 

so:

- fix the bug that the payload has to be set twice to make the CG work properly

- make a button-pressed visual state so you can easily tell when the button click was accepted, this also goes for the v-speed buttons especially

 

also kind of related: the plane comes off the ground very easily but right after takeoff, you need to add a LOOOT of back elevator to keep it pitching up towards the FD horizontal bars. this also feels quite odd, maybe there's a bug there as well

 

 

 

Can confirm this as well, at least from setting the zero fuel weight and fuel.  Clicking on set payload twice seems to set the correct value.

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I was now experimenting with the SET PAYLOAD IN SIM function. The only weights it's able to change for me is Fuel quantity. It's unable to change any of the other weight values of MSFS. The TOW starts to differ between EFB and FS panel whenever I change something on EFB and press Set Payload. It won't do a thing :( Seems like off to flying default weight figures until it's solved.

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