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Aerosoft Aircraft: Twin Otter


Mathijs Kok
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11 hours ago, EasternT3 said:

Although I see what you mean and yes I agree I am happy with the content provide thus far, but look at it this way, company A sells a product for £100, and sell 100 units, they lose £3,500 to MS/Asobo, 1000 units it's £35,000, and a few add-ons have quite probably sold north of this number, yes Microsoft is like any other company and wants to see a ROI for MSFS, but to me their current cut is for me too big, surely 5%-10% would be more reasonable especially in a reality of everything being marketplace exclusive. If Asobo/MS are desperate for money, I'd rather pay a modest subscription amount for the base sim every year

 

If we sell a product via the Marketplace we do not 'lose' any money. For these sales Microsoft handles the distribution, updates, all sales actions, sales support and part of marketing and public relation. If we would sell the same product on our own shop we would have to pay for all of that. Now exactly how much that is depends a lot on the product and the scalability. But if you pay via CC or PP we have to pay to have that done. If we send the file to you, we pay for the bandwidth, if we add the product to our shop somebody has to do that and that costs money.

 

The 30% most stores now ask (often lower if you sell a lot) is enough to pay for all of that. And if you do a good job you make some profit.  Remember we are not only a producer but also a reseller so we do exactly what Steam or the Marketplace does. We take part of the sales price to handle the sale, sales support and distribution. At 5% or 10% we would make a solid loss on every single sale and I am damned sure the Marketplace would as well. Remember it took Steam over a decade to break even at 30%.  And to make real money you need to sell way (way....) over a 1000 copies. If we would aim for that for the Twin Otter I might as well stop now as we would lose hundreds of thousands of Euro's.

 

The Marketplace offers an ease of use that is highly attractive for many users. No matter how you think about it, it is a huge factor in the current market. I am not hesitant to say we could not do without at this moment. I would not know how to reach those customers. Exactly how it is for Steam. 

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1 hour ago, Mathijs Kok said:

 

If we sell a product via the Marketplace we do not 'lose' any money. For these sales Microsoft handles the distribution, updates, all sales actions, sales support and part of marketing and public relation. If we would sell the same product on our own shop we would have to pay for all of that. Now exactly how much that is depends a lot on the product and the scalability. But if you pay via CC or PP we have to pay to have that done. If we send the file to you, we pay for the bandwidth, if we add the product to our shop somebody has to do that and that costs money.

 

The 30% most stores now ask (often lower if you sell a lot) is enough to pay for all of that. And if you do a good job you make some profit.  Remember we are not only a producer but also a reseller so we do exactly what Steam or the Marketplace does. We take part of the sales price to handle the sale, sales support and distribution. At 5% or 10% we would make a solid loss on every single sale and I am damned sure the Marketplace would as well. Remember it took Steam over a decade to break even at 30%.  And to make real money you need to sell way (way....) over a 1000 copies. If we would aim for that for the Twin Otter I might as well stop now as we would lose hundreds of thousands of Euro's.

 

The Marketplace offers an ease of use that is highly attractive for many users. No matter how you think about it, it is a huge factor in the current market. I am not hesitant to say we could not do without at this moment. I would not know how to reach those customers. Exactly how it is for Steam. 

Thanks for the great insight into the workings of the marketplace

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13 hours ago, Mathijs Kok said:

At 5% or 10% we would make a solid loss on every single sale and I am damned sure the Marketplace would as well

Exactly what I thought! thank you for the insightful stuff :)

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22 hours ago, Mathijs Kok said:

The Marketplace offers an ease of use that is highly attractive for many users. No matter how you think about it, it is a huge factor in the current market. I am not hesitant to say we could not do without at this moment. I would not know how to reach those customers. Exactly how it is for Steam.

I guess that's one of the big ifs I wonder what the flight simming world would look like today if MS hadn't pulled out 16 years ago, the loss of that reach to potential people that would have found this hobby(can I call it that without pissing people off!!!), at the end of the day its all about accessibility and exposure.

 

Marketplace is a little like package holidays, for the customer its easy, should offer a level of security(although I'm disappointed(and I'm trying to be as kind and diplomatic as I can!)with some of the items they have permitted on there)and is a one stop shop. Yes there is a good chance with the package holiday you could get it cheaper purchasing each component independently and for the hotel perhaps you "lose" part of your cut working directly with a tour operator... But if you are some three star hotel in Slovenia the additional reach is likely a game changer.

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Another test flight. Testing out stuff inside the plane so missed this view for the longest time ! Sure is pretty. I'm afraid my screen cap method does not do it justice. Sorry...

 

image.thumb.png.264b63375d248435bcdd3c82ddb9c979.png

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These testers pictures don't tell us much about the plane.  It is look like looking through flightsim.to liveries pictures book.  Tell us more what is inside the plane, what its sensitivities are like with your peripherals setting.  Things like that.

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5 hours ago, DC6Pilot said:

These testers pictures don't tell us much about the plane.  It is look like looking through flightsim.to liveries pictures book.  Tell us more what is inside the plane, what its sensitivities are like with your peripherals setting.  Things like that.

yes, let's hear some feedback from the testing crowd.......even edited feedback would be better than none...pics speak for themselves, but what are performance, behaviours, handling, sounds, reactions, etc all like? 

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I understand what you are saying. I think all I can say though is that I am impressed with the attention and commitment to detail and realism in this project. Y'all wont be disappointed. :)

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1 hour ago, Trevor Hannant said:

Bear in mind that the inside isn't complete:

 

I'm sure interior pics will come once AS allow them to post them...

 

Will make some this week. 

 

Almost all testing and correcting of the external model has been completed btw!

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11 hours ago, kbohme said:

I understand what you are saying. I think all I can say though is that I am impressed with the attention and commitment to detail and realism in this project. Y'all wont be disappointed. :)

yes totally agree. Really promising to see this level of attention and testing.  That's why Aerosoft's products are so credible and the reputation of the company so valid.

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On 10/12/2021 at 5:17 AM, bluemoon51 said:

Marketplace is a little like package holidays, for the customer its easy, should offer a level of security(although I'm disappointed(and I'm trying to be as kind and diplomatic as I can!)with some of the items they have permitted on there)and is a one stop shop.

There is another consideration not mentioned in this thread and that is the issue of a number of us who purchased the SIM on release last year who still can't purchase ANY products from the "Market Place" despite three re-installs all 178Gb of it and 3+ months following every direction of support ??? without success until they eventually gave up.

 

So without being able to purchase from individual developers like Aerosoft and JustFlight etc we would have no access to quality add on aircraft  at all.  I have spent hundreds if not thousands of dollars on add-ons for FSX and XPlane and to have a developer like Carenado flick you the bird when you ask to purchase an old favourite like the WACO direct, because I cant use the Market Place and which I have previously purchased from them direct for both FSX and XPlane sticks in my craw.

 

I noted a previous post from Mathijs saying one of the reasons Aerosoft sells in both markets is that they value the contact with their customers which is why I keep coming back to them - something Carenado and the other exclusives should think about - as Carenado previous customers are no longer theirs, they are now customers of Microsoft. 

 

As an aside I cannot for the life of me understand what is so hard about be able to buy add-ons through the Microsoft Store as well as the Market Place - That's where I bought the sim - That's how the rest of the SIM World works so what's the Problem ??????

 

To be honest I will just about be content once I get my hands on the Twin Otter (which I also have in FSX and XPlane) to add to the CRJ and my JustFlights PA28s and a couple of others in MSFS. I'm just about over the whole MSFS experience from what I've experienced to date so when its down or crashed by a the next Windows Update I can at least retire to the no hassle XPlane world with my  BAe 146 and imminent XPQ400 and other old favourite's - The world over there doesn't look too bad with a $1000 bucks or so of ORBX regions etc and who knows what XP 12 will bring as it matures.

 

 

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8 hours ago, PeteB said:

There is another consideration not mentioned in this thread and that is the issue of a number of us who purchased the SIM on release last year who still can't purchase ANY products from the "Market Place" despite three re-installs all 178Gb of it and 3+ months following every direction of support ??? without success until they eventually gave up.

 

Silly question - have you tried NOT running the sim as administrator? This is the usual cause of Marketplace malfunctions.

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1 hour ago, Danny Vincken said:

 

So no one is working on the lots of CRJ bugs then?

I'm sure the list above wasn't an extensive list of everyone working for Aerosoft on all their projects. It seemed to me to be an illustration of the diversity of the team working on this one specific project  

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On 13.10.2021 at 20:34, Mathijs Kok sagte:
  • I worked a few hours on the manual. It's rather special, it actually a complete book.  It contains all the info, but I think most customers will like to actually read it.

 

 

Now that you say that... I think I will read my "Twin Otter Extended - Grundlagen, Bedienung und Verfahren" book again to shorten the waiting time.

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30 minutes ago, Otto Groschenbügel said:

 

Now that you say that... I think I will read my "Twin Otter Extended - Grundlagen, Bedienung und Verfahren" book again to shorten the waiting time.

 

Did you know that book will be part of the new Twin Otter? I am translating it as we speak.

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