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Aerosoft Aircraft: CRJ


Hans Hartmann
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Clearly the process of adding content to MSFS isn't as easy as pretty much all the developers had thought, basically if you look at the expected timelines for release they have now all been missed, not just Aerosoft.

More generally, I'm not crazy for direct comparisons between MSFS and the other flight simulation software out there(and truly hate how people throw around the simmer-gamer tags at anyone that doesn't hold their opinion). The fact of the matter is you aren't comparing like for like. People have spent 100s 1,000s of dollars(or whatever currency you want to replace with), on upgrading the BASE GAME with the other titles, we are all pretty much playing MSFS out of the box.

That's why this CRJ is so anticipated it could well be a game changer, but as I said in an earlier post. it's not something Aerosoft can afford to get wrong. So while I'm disappointed that there will be a delay(and likely quite a significant one), I would sooner Aerosoft get the release right, than the whole thing is a buggy mess(I also hope that Aerosoft have been in discussion with how updates are handled with Asobo because it's not working with Carenado aircraft especially well right now!        

 

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vor 7 Stunden , vladimir72 sagte:

However, for people who want to learn

 

You don't learn to fly in a flight sim. You get a general idea. A feeling. That is so basic, that even FS5 was able to deliver it. It helped me a lot. But there's much more to it. Actually, MSFS does the best job so far to emulate the effect that weather has on your aircraft. Those gentle bumps and movements.

 

However, you learn how to fly IRL. Then you take that experience and practise things in the sim.

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7 hours ago, vladimir72 said:

 

well, I don't know what is the reality but there are a number of  important limitations in flying IFR on MSFS. The behaviour of the airliners is often inconsistent, even with the mods. This might be easier to handle for experienced simmers and real life pilots. However, for people who want to learn it's incredibly difficult to understand if they are doing something wrong or if they are encountering one of the numerous and ever changing bugs.

FS2020 is indeed visually stunning but having to use microsoft products for work every single day, I don't trust them a single bit that they will fix things over time.

The reason we are eagerly anticipating the CRJ is because we all hope that Aerosoft will fix the current limitations and erratic behaviour of FS2020. If they need time to do so, I am very happy they are taking it.

 

 

If you can't operate the a320nx effectively, especially with the wealth of tutorials there's online (even from real pilots) the issue is on your side, not on MSFS'. 

 

The stuff about "not trusting Microsoft" is laughable. They've already done better and faster work on this sim than any previous sim's developer after launch. 

 

The reason we're eagerly anticipating the CRJ is because the sim doesn't have a regional jet, and regional jets are some of the most interesting to operate, exactly like many are waiting eagerly for the Twin Otter, because the sim doesn't have a island-hopping, mountain-climbing turboprop airliner, and that's another thing people love to operate in sims. 

 

If one simply wants an airliner that works extremely well, with great depth of simulation for this stage of a sim's lifetime, it's already available from FBW.

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13 hours ago, EvidencePlz said:

Can confirm. I've watched you on Twitch flying exclusively IFR in all kind of aircraft in MSFS, be it a C152 or DA60, or A320 or CJ4 (the last three being the incredible mods by MrTommy, FlyByWire and Working Title respectively) and nothing but IFR, for countless hours, even with failures (honorable mention to RandFailuresFS2020 developer Kaneron from Czech Republic...no...Poland...remember the little gaffe during your MSFS official stream? just kidding). Thank you for your dedication and contributions to aviation and flight simulation.

Thanks Evidence! And thanks for mentioning MrTommy, who fully deserves mention in the same breath as Working Title and FlyByWire. And yes, Czech Republic, lololol, you don’t forget quickly, do you???

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12 hours ago, Aplato said:

 

I just want to vouch for Fabio -- he's fantastic. I'm not sure if he's in the beta program or not, but if he isn't, he should be. I believe he flew Embraer rather than the CRJ, but he is the type of person who will exhaustively consume the documentation and explore the systems in-depth. He was even featured on the official Microsoft Flight Simulator stream recently. I have no doubt he could provide both valuable feedback and publicity.

Thanks Aplato! 

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10 hours ago, vladimir72 said:

 

well, I don't know what is the reality but there are a number of  important limitations in flying IFR on MSFS. The behaviour of the airliners is often inconsistent, even with the mods. This might be easier to handle for experienced simmers and real life pilots. However, for people who want to learn it's incredibly difficult to understand if they are doing something wrong or if they are encountering one of the numerous and ever changing bugs.

FS2020 is indeed visually stunning but having to use microsoft products for work every single day, I don't trust them a single bit that they will fix things over time.

The reason we are eagerly anticipating the CRJ is because we all hope that Aerosoft will fix the current limitations and erratic behaviour of FS2020. If they need time to do so, I am very happy they are taking it.

 

Hi Vladimir,

 

You make an important point. When learning, it is important that the tools you use are consistent, so that you know what to expect. Having aircraft or avionics behave erratically confuses the learning process tremendously. 
 

Now, we’ve come a long way since releasing on August 18th, but there are still some inconsistencies. As you mentioned, I’m able to work around them due to my experience. But this is an important limitation of the sim at the moment. It does not affect IFR flying only, this can affect any type of flying. 
 

I will couch that by saying that there are many default aircraft that I find 100% reliable after all the updates, and that could well be used for someone’s first sim experience and result in positive training. But you do have to know which aircraft to use. The community is your friend there. 

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vor 12 Minuten, The Flying Fabio sagte:

My instructor, to this day, does not believe that I had never flown IFR in an aircraft before. He said it was impossible to have that kind of performance without real flight experience. Well... :) I went on to pass my check ride a short 8 days later. 

 

I have similar experience, but if you read carefully, it doesn't contradict what I said. It can help a lot - but you don't learn how to fly an actual plane. There are things you just cannot simulate. But you can use this experience, to make your simulation as close to real as possible.

 

It's your own responisbility. You can land a C172 with 120 knots, or you can do it how it would be advisable IRL.

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34 minutes ago, The Flying Fabio said:

Just to add a little info, I’m planning on teaching a full Initial Type Rating Course for the CRJ once it’s out (something I’ve done, as my job, for other aircraft numerous times). I’ve been studying the aircraft for a while now, and have started designing the lessons.

 

The course will take around 10 days, depending on what Aerosoft ends up simulating. Nonetheless, we are going to go DEEP into anything that is simulated. I can’t wait!

F9762185-EF4D-498A-AFF2-E0A28AB6CCD8.jpeg

 

Wonderful where do I have to sign for the course? Do you do virtual private lesson too? :)

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Vor 1 Stunde, The Flying Fabio sagte:


I’m going to disagree here. I used Microsoft Flight Sim (it was the only sim out back then) to learn IFR flying before starting my flight training for that license. Because of the sim, I aced my first flight, which was an NDB approach, under the hood, no GPS, and 23 kts of crosswind (at my request). I performed a hold, then a procedure turn, and nailed it all. This was at the Comair Aviation Academy in Sanford, FL. 
 

My instructor, to this day, does not believe that I had never flown IFR in an aircraft before. He said it was impossible to have that kind of performance without real flight experience. Well... :) I went on to pass my check ride a short 8 days later. 

 

Further, I have worked in the real-world simulation industry for 15 years. I can tell you that MSFS gets a LOT of things better than the multi-million dollar, FAA- and EASA-certified sims that are leading the industry today. And yet, in those sims, we certify people to go fly a plane, by themselves, that they’ve never set foot on before. And their first flight, ever, in that aircraft, after the check ride with us, will be without an instructor and with passengers. We do that every single day. Using sims that are, generally speaking, less faithful to real flying than I find MSFS to be. 
 

Sorry to hijack this topic, but I felt this was a necessary point to be made. 

First: I am totally going to join your lessons. Really looking forward. Big thank you for the work :)

Second: I totally agree with you. I am currently doing PPL and flown my solo at 5 hours into training. Now I dont like to tell people this, because some take it for bragging and I hate bragging. But to make a point here, this would never be possible without having hundreds of hours in FSX, P3D and now MSFS. We also did some instrument training and my instructor was blown that I could do everything in the first lessons without any problems. I learned flying with my simulator, learned system with my simulator. Also now that MSFS features satellite data its easy to get comfortable with new airports without having flown to them irl. In one lessons we went a small airfield where you would need to fly a certain path for the traffic pattern. And thanks to MSFS orientation was so easy and like I have been there before. All this safes so much money in flight training!

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2 hours ago, The Flying Fabio said:

Just to add a little info, I’m planning on teaching a full Initial Type Rating Course for the CRJ once it’s out (something I’ve done, as my job, for other aircraft numerous times). I’ve been studying the aircraft for a while now, and have started designing the lessons.

 

The course will take around 10 days, depending on what Aerosoft ends up simulating. Nonetheless, we are going to go DEEP into anything that is simulated. I can’t wait!

F9762185-EF4D-498A-AFF2-E0A28AB6CCD8.jpeg

Sweet stuff! I love going in depth and studying hard when it comes to things I enjoy, like aviation.

 

I couldn’t focus on books we read in school, etc. because I simply have no interest. When I do, I can read and understand it very well. With my PPL, the content was very lengthy and required lots of studying but I got it done. I enjoyed it along the way.

 

The CRJ is an interesting and unique aircraft and I really do look forward to studying the systems and taking her into the beautiful skies of MSFS.

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On 12/30/2020 at 9:08 AM, patiofurniture said:

EGLL BPK7F BPK REDFA POVEL L986 MAG POLON BEMBI PEKIT A83 TAGAN TIROM A845 ATASH A846 ABDAN A909 LEMOD N644 DI M875 KAKID M770 OBMOG L515 PUT B579 VPL W531 VIH R325 VJB G579 SJ A464 TPG M635 ATMAP A576 PKS W440 HOGAN V599 WATLE W652 ODALE ODALE7 YSSY

As a "pilot" Who mostly flies short-medium haul this routing is alarmingly Long... 

 

I can't help but to think of putting this in a "regional style" fms like the Q400 or erj, would probably take a lot longer... Can't speek for the crj though, I've never flown it but I think it's got a more boeing/Airbus style fmc/mcdu. That's a relief after going through fms torture in the erj... 

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I rarely looked at this forum in the last few days because it had pretty much turned into a complete mess with hardly any posts actually about the CRJ. I'm glad to see it has become a nice topic again! Happy new year guys, I can tell this year is gonna be great for flight simmers. 

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Hi,

I am new to this forum, but NOT new to Flight Simulation. Have been in the hobby since MSFS5.1 (1995). Also disappointed with the pushback of the CRJ, but very understandable as all parties what to make sure it is as good as possible for the initial release.

I look forward to great conversations here.

Happy New Year!

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13 hours ago, The Flying Fabio said:

Using sims that are, generally speaking, less faithful to real flying than I find MSFS to be. 

 

I find this to be fascinating. Can you please elaborate a bit in what why MFSF is more faithful than a IRL flight simulator?

 

In my previous message, I obviously meant learning to flight sim, not to fly IRL. I am not a pilot and no plans to become one.

 

I really look forward to your course about the CRJ. Thank you for doing that

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vor 9 Stunden , vladimir72 sagte:

I find this to be fascinating. Can you please elaborate a bit in what why MFSF is more faithful than a IRL flight simulator?

 

One thing where MSFS probably excels over any other flight sim, is practising VFR. You can pick a route and familiarize with it in the sim before flying it IRL.

 

In other sims you usually have very basic scenery, with streets, rivers and mountains where they belong, but the rest is procedurally generated. In other sims you would have to spend a lot of work, hard drive space and money and probably still won't get the same coverage.

 

Another point that surprisingly gets overlooked all too often when talking about flight dynamics, is the weather simulation. A plane naturally interacts with air - and thus, with weather!

 

MSFS does have a consistent model-approach. In other sims, the local conditions might match, but the behavior is far from believeable, with noticeable weather reloads once you enter different zones. It can happen that you are on approach in CAVOK conditions and then suddenly end up in a thick layer of fog. Or instant wind reloads on cruise altitude, which almost throw your plane over. :D

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12 hours ago, vladimir72 said:

 

I find this to be fascinating. Can you please elaborate a bit in what why MFSF is more faithful than a IRL flight simulator?

 

The visuals MSFS offers are so much better than most RW sims. Some of the newest are looking nice but most do not go beyond a stock FS9 environment or even worse.

 

I also use MSFS to get acquainted with new airport environments I will fly to IRL. It is a great tool to get a sense of "the lay of the land". This in combination with detailed add on airports is really golden when it comes to personal flight preperation.

 

Another aspect that is really useful in P3D, XP, MSFS and the like are virtual cockpits that you can use to get familiar with the cockpits and the flows. Realistically modelled systems are nice to have but not necessary to prepare you for your initial introduction to a new type. When I did my CRJ Type rating in 2000, the trainingcenter used life scale flat cardboard models for learning flows and checklist handling. I wished then I had Virtual Cockpits like we have now on our computers.

 

And there is more; Virtual Reality really ups the ante here. Airlines are beginning to use stand alone VCs ,and even whole aircraft models, with VR headsets now so you can train yourself at home before you even set foot into a trainingcenter. This you can already do for yourself with MSFS and a VR headset!

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1 hour ago, The Dude said:

 

The visuals MSFS offers are so much better than most RW sims. Some of the newest are looking nice but most do not go beyond a stock FS9 environment or even worse.

 

Some of the pro pretend pilots will tell you that visuals don't matter 😂

 

Edit: and quite obviously one got triggered 😂

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