Jump to content

A330 approach Managed SPD


Viperlead

Recommended Posts

Good day gents.

 

I found out a problem with the logic between managed speed and airplane configuration during approach. This on the A330.

Whenever the Approach Phase is activated, the new MANAGED speed target is now VAPP. All good here, but, the airplane misses the green dot and F gates as it decelerates towards VAPP. Speed should stop at green DOT no matter the managed SPD target until FLAPS 1 are selected. Then it should continue to decelerate towards F speed gate and hold it until FLAPS 2 are extended and so with FLAPS 3. VAPP should only be reached when FLAPS FULL are selected. If I let the plane to miss the speed gates, the speed continue dropping until alpha floor is reached. In order to avoid this I have to pull speed into selected mode and from there I have to adjust my speed until fully config, then push speed into managed again. This method is commonly used, specially when ATC requires you to mantain certain speed until certain fix. But the MANAGED SPD behavior is not correct during approach and configuration phases.

 

Hope you get the chance to take a look at it.

 

Loving the plane no matter what! Thank you.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, Viperlead said:

Good day gents.

 

I found out a problem with the logic between managed speed and airplane configuration during approach. This on the A330.

Whenever the Approach Phase is activated, the new MANAGED speed target is now VAPP. All good here, but, the airplane misses the green dot and F gates as it decelerates towards VAPP. Speed should stop at green DOT no matter the managed SPD target until FLAPS 1 are selected. Then it should continue to decelerate towards F speed gate and hold it until FLAPS 2 are extended and so with FLAPS 3. VAPP should only be reached when FLAPS FULL are selected. If I let the plane to miss the speed gates, the speed continue dropping until alpha floor is reached. In order to avoid this I have to pull speed into selected mode and from there I have to adjust my speed until fully config, then push speed into managed again. This method is commonly used, specially when ATC requires you to mantain certain speed until certain fix. But the MANAGED SPD behavior is not correct during approach and configuration phases.

 

Hope you get the chance to take a look at it.

 

Loving the plane no matter what! Thank you.

 

 

Yes sir, it's not currently working as it should.  It actually gets worse if you do a Go Around or for any reason have to break off and re-select the approach as the aircraft will stay at Green Dot Speed and the F and S speed tape indicators will not show up and if you stay in managed speed your IAS is usually above 200 kts (if you're still in Managed Mode) as the aircraft follows the glideslope.

 

The good news?  We are already working on speed issues and I'll be sure to update our bug tracking database with the information  you were kind enough to provide.  We're also working on Ground Speed Mini!

 

For now, I recommend using the Selected Mode for Speed during approach.

 

Thanks again!

 

 

 

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

50 minutes ago, Viperlead said:

Ground speed mini would be awesome!

 

Thanks for the answer Dave. will kindly wait for the updates.

 

Regards.


You are most welcome my friend!

 

Best wishes!

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes this is getting very annoying with this aircraft, to a point its getting un enjoyable to fly. Did a flight today hoping the latest update fixed it but nope.If you fix the speed issue the bird will be great especially with the latest update that just came out. Please put this on the top of the priority list! Cheers.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

A320-21 Pro v1.3.0.1

A330 Pro ev 1.0.0.7

P3DV4.5hf2

 

Personally I feel that the FBW of the A330 is now very close to perfection.

 

On the other hand I have serious troubles with its auto-throttle:
In the take off phase, cruising flight, descent, everything is ok.

But the approach and landing phase in auto-throttle have become unmanageable (compared to the A320-21 which are perfectly managed with auto-throttle).

 

In summary here is what happens during the approach and landing  phase : 

 

Suddenly the approach speed is very high and then, conversely, in the final phase, the speed drops inexorably below the target speed.

This happens regardless of the airport and weather conditions.
To ensure that everything goes correctly I have to deactivate the auto-throttle already on the approach phase.

 

I don't know if I'm the only one concerned by this issue but once again the auto-throttle of the A320-21 works perfectly in exactly the same conditions.

 

Cheers

Reccio

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Recciosilva said:

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

This happens regardless of the airport and weather conditions.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - 

I don't know if I'm the only one concerned by this issue but once again the auto-throttle of the A320-21 works perfectly in exactly the same conditions.

 

Self-correction :
In fact the autothrottle of my A330 works perfectly in all steps of flight including approach and landing on one condition:
That there is no weather engine applied except a P3DV4 weather theme.
If I apply Active Sky P4 live weather or the IVAO Network live weather engine then the autothrottle behaves as I indicated in my previous post. That does not happen with the A320-21.

 

Cheers

Reccio

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, Recciosilva said:

A320-21 Pro v1.3.0.1

A330 Pro ev 1.0.0.7

P3DV4.5hf2

 

Personally I feel that the FBW of the A330 is now very close to perfection.

 

On the other hand I have serious troubles with its auto-throttle:
In the take off phase, cruising flight, descent, everything is ok.

But the approach and landing phase in auto-throttle have become unmanageable (compared to the A320-21 which are perfectly managed with auto-throttle).

 

In summary here is what happens during the approach and landing  phase : 

 

Suddenly the approach speed is very high and then, conversely, in the final phase, the speed drops inexorably below the target speed.

This happens regardless of the airport and weather conditions.
To ensure that everything goes correctly I have to deactivate the auto-throttle already on the approach phase.

 

I don't know if I'm the only one concerned by this issue but once again the auto-throttle of the A320-21 works perfectly in exactly the same conditions.

 

Cheers

Reccio

Exactly what mine does. Mine only appears in the approach phase and speed goes through the roof and then drops after you are frantically trying to get it down. This is the unenjoyable part especially when online. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

P3DV4.5HF2
A 333 v1.0.0.7

 

Hi,

I used the Active sky settings [Aerosoft CFD Settings V1.1.CFG] from the Aerosoft support  provided in another post : 

[Aerosoft CFD Settings V1.1.CFG]

 

I only added an option : 
General options /Prevent downloads on approach = True

 

Then  I performed with A333 pro an approach and Landing flight to LFPO ILS runway 06 with Active sky live weather engine.
The landing is carried out in full A/P1+A/P2 in order to check the autotothrottle system.

 

This time I found that the autothrottle worked much better than during my previous flights and especially in a more regulated way.

 

The approach phase is perfect.

However, it is still difficult to get down to the  target speeds, especially in the final stage.

 

If you are interested I've recorded a video flight on my Twitch account  that might be more helpful.  
But I don't know if I'm allowed to publish this link here.

 

Reccio

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, Recciosilva said:

P3DV4.5HF2
A 333 v1.0.0.7

 

Hi,

I used the Active sky settings [Aerosoft CFD Settings V1.1.CFG] from the Aerosoft support  provided in another post : 

[Aerosoft CFD Settings V1.1.CFG]

 

I only added an option : 
General options /Prevent downloads on approach = True

 

Then  I performed with A333 pro an approach and Landing flight to LFPO ILS runway 06 with Active sky live weather engine.
The landing is carried out in full A/P1+A/P2 in order to check the autotothrottle system.

 

This time I found that the autothrottle worked much better than during my previous flights and especially in a more regulated way.

 

The approach phase is perfect.

However, it is still difficult to get down to the  target speeds, especially in the final stage.

 

If you are interested I've recorded a video flight on my Twitch account  that might be more helpful.  
But I don't know if I'm allowed to publish this link here.

 

Reccio

 

Good to know, I was the one who created that ActiveSky profile.

 

Regarding how slippery the A330 is, that's pretty accurate to the real thing but you don't have to take my word for it, check out the post below by an A330 pilot:

 

https://karlenepetitt.blogspot.com/2010/10/a330-managing-mass.html

 

 

Best wishes for Happy Flights!

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It is better with that .cfg file I must admit except for the final as stated above.

 

One question that hasn't been answered though is why does a 3rd party program need to be manipulated in order to get one plane in p3d etc working and accepted that this is the fix for it? No other plane needs this kind of manipulation including your a318-320 series. Someone that is getting this aircraft out of the box and not knowing this fix will still come up with the speed issues. Its unacceptable to assume/expect people to make this fix.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 1/24/2020 at 5:14 PM, benjoglove said:

It is better with that .cfg file I must admit except for the final as stated above.

 

One question that hasn't been answered though is why does a 3rd party program need to be manipulated in order to get one plane in p3d etc working and accepted that this is the fix for it? No other plane needs this kind of manipulation including your a318-320 series. Someone that is getting this aircraft out of the box and not knowing this fix will still come up with the speed issues. Its unacceptable to assume/expect people to make this fix.

 

Ben

 

Regarding the speed on approach, please take a look at the link I provided in my post above, the short article is all about handling the A330 on approach. After reading the short article I think you'll see our flight model is very realistic (and that is not easy to do in FSX/P3D).

 

I am unsure what you mean regarding manipulation.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 1/24/2020 at 10:43 PM, DaveCT2003 said:

 

Regarding how slippery the A330 is, that's pretty accurate to the real thing but you don't have to take my word for it, check out the post below by an A330 pilot:

https://karlenepetitt.blogspot.com/2010/10/a330-managing-mass.html

 

Dave 
Thank you for this useful information.

 

The advice of an expert like Karlene Petitt is important. 
Especially about the A330:
"If you attempt to slow this plane then think you're going to capture the glideslope, it won't happen."

 

And it's true that the A330 is reputed by pilots to be difficult to slow down.

It also appears to me that A330 pilots seem to be using speed brakes more often than on other Airbus series.
as can be seen in this excellent video  on timing  [07:55] :

[Airbus A330 - Approach and Landing in Miami]

Please login to display this image.

 

So I did another flight like the previous one but this time with Active sky live weather set to default settings.
Still with the autothrottle activated, during the final phase I used the speed brakes as soon as the target speed was exceeded or not reached.
The result is really impressive !

 

However, I would be curious to know if speed brake is used as much during approach by A330 pilots.

 

Reccio

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Recciosilva said:

However, I would be curious to know if speed brake is used as much during approach by A330 pilots.

 

It simply depends on too many things to answer that, except to say that every approach, no matter how similar, is different due to the many different variables including weather, dodging weather, at which point you turn to final, what the weight and configuration of the aircraft is, does ATC need to have you stay at a higher speed until the last minute, etc. etc. etc..

 

This is actually what makes flying in our hobby interesting and even exciting, especially if you're flying online during an event, no too approaches are the same even to the same runway!  Picture this:

 

REAL WORLD:  You're the Captain of an aircraft flying an approach into Atlanta Hartsfield International (KATL), which is the the single busiest airport in the world.  It's summer, and true to form the afternoon thunderstorms in the Southeastern US where KATL is located had a hold on all outbound and inbound flights including yours.  A brief break in the weather allows the controllers to get a few more aircraft down and yours is one of them, and in order to get as many aircraft down ATC has you maintain 210 knots until the IF and then 180 knots until the final approach waypoint.  This is where your pilot skills and knowledge and experience with the aircraft come into play, as you take control of the aircraft to bring her in on time, helping your passgengers to make their connecting flights and helping you to keep  your reputation with your airline.

 

FLIGHT SIM:  You're flying a large online event.  It's been 4 hours sitting at the computer, which includes the time you spent developing a flight plan, getting all your software up and programmed, pre-flighting the aircraft, getting your clearance, taking off, and making the flight into the destination airport. It's late, you're tired, and the wife/girlfriend has already said three times "are you E.V.E.R. going to get off the computer?  The last thing you need is a Go Around. 

 

Yeah, different reasons, but the same priority - get the damned thing down the first time.  Flight sim can indeed be pretty realistic.

 

By the way, you really should check out our Flight Sim Community!   You'd love it!

 

 

Best wishes!

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue. Privacy Policy & Terms of Use