Flight losing control still

[DaveCT2003 2553]

Ah, that's right!  Thanks for reminding me that we're both in Florida!  I deal with so  many people that I'd forgotten - I'll try to remember that from now on!

 

That's GREAT that your son is coming in!  My son is serving in the Air Force and is on the other side of the county... I miss him dearly. He's about 5 years from retiring from the military like his dad and grandfather, though I won't be surprised if he stays longer.  Anyway, I'm happy that you'll be spending time with your son my friend!  That is just so GREAT!

Let me know when you are available and we'll get this done.

 

 

[Detail50 17]

3 hours ago, DaveCT2003 said:

Ah, that's right!  Thanks for reminding me that we're both in Florida!  I deal with so  many people that I'd forgotten - I'll try to remember that from now on!

 

That's GREAT that your son is coming in!  My son is serving in the Air Force and is on the other side of the county... I miss him dearly. He's about 5 years from retiring from the military like his dad and grandfather, though I won't be surprised if he stays longer.  Anyway, I'm happy that you'll be spending time with your son my friend!  That is just so GREAT!

Let me know when you are available and we'll get this done.

 

 

Thank him from all of us for his service.

 

I have a 320 in the air as I've done a few things since the last flight,   just passed Scottsdale on wasy from KSAN to KJFX.   I lowered frame rate to 18 this time.

[Detail50 17]

Had a CTD well into a flight from KSAN to KBWI.     This is the only image I have to share before the crash,   my guess it was about 20 > 30 mins or so after this.   At the point of the crash everything was normal, and I think I was about 400 > 500 miles from TOD

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[Detail50 17]

I flew overnight from YBBN to PHNL,  the flight was solid up until 60 miles from the airport when it encountered again loss of control and wide oscillation of speed again.   The target FPS rate was set to 18 in P3D.   Nothing new here, since the A330 was introduced it happens repeatably.   I attached a screen shot to show how solid the flight was mid route.  It's only when it encounters a FPS issue that this happens as has been explained to me.   Just to repeat again I have a i7-7700, GTX 1660, 32 G Ram.   According to the scores these components should play this sim well.   My ips down bandwidth is around 215 Mbps typically.

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[DaveCT2003 2553]

Ray, will you be available in about an hour to work with me?

 

[B777ER 8]

Dave, side note, what do you use to keep all your drivers up to date? I use Driver Booster 7 Pro.

[DaveCT2003 2553]

20 hours ago, B777ER said:

Dave, side note, what do you use to keep all your drivers up to date? I use Driver Booster 7 Pro.

 

That is what I use as well.

 

[DaveCT2003 2553]

For those following this thread...

 

I spent some time and did a partial system groom on Ray's computer, and got him setup with some tools to monitor his CPU and GPU Load and frame rates in real time, and stream his flights so we could see what was happening during his flights. 

 

Like many here, Ray is brand new to flying the Airbus, and we found a few operational things being done out of sequence which resulted in placing the aircraft outside it's operating envelope which in turn caused the issues he was experiencing.  This happens more often than people realize when someone is new to flying the Airbus.

 

This raises several very good points which we should all bear in mind:

 

1. If one is new / inexperienced flying the Airbus, they should take some time to fly the Aerosoft Tutorial (see our Documentation) several times before trying a flight on their own, regardless of whether or not the Copilot/Checklist is used. 

 

2. The Copilot and Checklist is designed to help familiarize people with the correct procedures for operating the Airbus, but it is NOT a replacement for the Tutorial. 

 

3. I have seen people still using the Copilot/Checklist after making 10, 20, or 30 flights with the Airbus, and I promise you that these people are only hurting themselves by doing this because instead of actually learning how to operate the Airbus and it's systems they are basically only learning how to operate the Copilot/Checklist - there is a world of difference between the two.   My advice is from the very first flight, the goal should be to get away from using the Copiloit and Checklist and operating the Airbus without them.

 

4. In the coming weeks we should have our Connected Flight Deck server back to being fully operational for the A318/A319/A320/A321 Professional and A330 Professional, and at some point in the future this will include our CRJ Professional.  Having used Shared Cockpit / Connected Flight Deck for the past 15 years I can tell you there is absolutely no better way to learn how to operate the aircraft than sharing the aircraft with an experienced person. 

 

Over the years I've heard people say "I want to learn how to operate the aircraft before I fly Connected Flight Deck", which is simply putting the cart before the horse. The only thing this does is allow people to develop very bad habits (which are very difficult to unlearn).  Additionally, some people think that they are going to be asked to perform real world checklists and they'll have to know all sorts of things when they make their first Connected Flight Deck flight. Anyone who expects a someone new to an aircraft to know and do these things is out of their mind, and if you run across someone like this then I recommend you avoid them at all costs as they are probably more interested in trying to impress you than helping you learn the aircraft. 

Connected Flight Deck should be FUN, with learning as a byproduct, not the other way around (at least for your first 10 flights or so).

 

5.  We're be teaching a variety of classes using our Virtual Classroom software in the soon to be announced Aerosoft Flight Sim Community.  These classes with span over many different aviation / flight sim topics including aircraft systems and operations. 

 

 

Anyway, I'm happy we finally solved Ray's issue.

 

Best wishes everyone!

 

[Detail50 17]

23 hours ago, DaveCT2003 said:

For those following this thread...

 

I spent some time and did a partial system groom on Ray's computer, and got him setup with some tools to monitor his CPU and GPU Load and frame rates in real time, and stream his flights so we could see what was happening during his flights. 

 

Like many here, Ray is brand new to flying the Airbus, and we found a few operational things being done out of sequence which resulted in placing the aircraft outside it's operating envelope which in turn caused the issues he was experiencing.  This happens more often than people realize when someone is new to flying the Airbus.

 

This raises several very good points which we should all bear in mind:

 

1. If one is new / inexperienced flying the Airbus, they should take some time to fly the Aerosoft Tutorial (see our Documentation) several times before trying a flight on their own, regardless of whether or not the Copilot/Checklist is used. 

 

2. The Copilot and Checklist is designed to help familiarize people with the correct procedures for operating the Airbus, but it is NOT a replacement for the Tutorial. 

 

3. I have seen people still using the Copilot/Checklist after making 10, 20, or 30 flights with the Airbus, and I promise you that these people are only hurting themselves by doing this because instead of actually learning how to operate the Airbus and it's systems they are basically only learning how to operate the Copilot/Checklist - there is a world of difference between the two.   My advice is from the very first flight, the goal should be to get away from using the Copiloit and Checklist and operating the Airbus without them.

 

4. In the coming weeks we should have our Connected Flight Deck server back to being fully operational for the A318/A319/A320/A321 Professional and A330 Professional, and at some point in the future this will include our CRJ Professional.  Having used Shared Cockpit / Connected Flight Deck for the past 15 years I can tell you there is absolutely no better way to learn how to operate the aircraft than sharing the aircraft with an experienced person. 

 

Over the years I've heard people say "I want to learn how to operate the aircraft before I fly Connected Flight Deck", which is simply putting the cart before the horse. The only thing this does is allow people to develop very bad habits (which are very difficult to unlearn).  Additionally, some people think that they are going to be asked to perform real world checklists and they'll have to know all sorts of things when they make their first Connected Flight Deck flight. Anyone who expects a someone new to an aircraft to know and do these things is out of their mind, and if you run across someone like this then I recommend you avoid them at all costs as they are probably more interested in trying to impress you than helping you learn the aircraft. 

Connected Flight Deck should be FUN, with learning as a byproduct, not the other way around (at least for your first 10 flights or so).

 

5.  We're be teaching a variety of classes using our Virtual Classroom software in the soon to be announced Aerosoft Flight Sim Community.  These classes with span over many different aviation / flight sim topics including aircraft systems and operations. 

 

 

Anyway, I'm happy we finally solved Ray's issue.

 

Best wishes everyone!

 

Dave,   i think the checklist comments are a good idea.  I know it would take some time, but a video using something like view focus with a voice over would be at least in my opinion be a great add to especially new people.  Just as a general comment the use of video and graphics as opposed to printed text has been proven to be much more effective in terms of communication and understanding.

[Detail50 17]

Dave,  I completed my overnight flight from SanFran to Osaka.  The flight was about 13:45 and I knew I was pushing the range and fuel (note I actually did run out of fuel about 400 miles out, but used the emergency fueling option to get me to the runway).   The whole flight was pretty much the way the way the aircraft should operate.   Only thing worth mentioning was on final approach the plane did encounter some oscillation, and the graph you helped me with showed FPS dropping from a consistent 30 to around 20, so that made sense with regards to what you had told me.

 

Good stuff Dave,  big shoutout for the help.

 

Ray

 

 

[DaveCT2003 2553]

3 hours ago, Detail50 said:

Dave,   i think the checklist comments are a good idea.  I know it would take some time, but a video using something like view focus with a voice over would be at least in my opinion be a great add to especially new people.  Just as a general comment the use of video and graphics as opposed to printed text has been proven to be much more effective in terms of communication and understanding.

 

That is an excellent idea my friend!

 

The problem with our creating a video tutorial is finding the time.  All of our people are working far beyond the 100% level right now.  But as soon as the right people have the time, I'm sure this will get done.

 

Thanks again!

 

3 minutes ago, Detail50 said:

Dave,  I completed my overnight flight from SanFran to Osaka.  The flight was about 13:45 and I knew I was pushing the range and fuel (note I actually did run out of fuel about 400 miles out, but used the emergency fueling option to get me to the runway).   The whole flight was pretty much the way the way the aircraft should operate.   Only thing worth mentioning was on final approach the plane did encounter some oscillation, and the graph you helped me with showed FPS dropping from a consistent 30 to around 20, so that made sense with regards to what you had told me.

 

Good stuff Dave,  big shoutout for the help.

 

Ray

 

 

 

Most welcome!

 

[Detail50 17]

Dave,   I just had that random loss of speed control happen, but this time I was watching.

 

Shortly after TOC the aircraft had continued on at proper cruise speed.   The FPS was actually on the chart was at about 50fps.  The slider is still on unlimited where we set it.

 

I heard the warning light go off and the aircraft went into a overspeed condition and started to climb,  I also noted that it had disengaged the autothrust button.   To regain control I decided to just re-engage autothrust and the plane returned to it's proper altitude and speed.  During the entire time the autopiloit button was still engaged.   Not sure how balance of flight will go,  it's a 6 hour flight, I'll see what happens.

 

There was no change in the FPS chart, it was rock solid.

[DaveCT2003 2553]

1 hour ago, Detail50 said:

Dave,   I just had that random loss of speed control happen, but this time I was watching.

 

Shortly after TOC the aircraft had continued on at proper cruise speed.   The FPS was actually on the chart was at about 50fps.  The slider is still on unlimited where we set it.

 

I heard the warning light go off and the aircraft went into a overspeed condition and started to climb,  I also noted that it had disengaged the autothrust button.   To regain control I decided to just re-engage autothrust and the plane returned to it's proper altitude and speed.  During the entire time the autopiloit button was still engaged.   Not sure how balance of flight will go,  it's a 6 hour flight, I'll see what happens.

 

There was no change in the FPS chart, it was rock solid.

 

Hello Ray, and thanks for the report.  We're aware this occurs and are working to discover why (we think it's a weather engine issue).  In fact, I believe this was one of your first reports here in the forum and my recommendation as the same as before, take control of the aircraft and return to normal flight.  But know that we are looking at this.

 

If you haven't made a flight since this happened, please zip your A330 Data folder and upload here.  That will help us!

 

Thanks again for the report.

 

 

[Detail50 17]

Where are Data Folders located?  Never done that before.   TY

 

[DaveCT2003 2553]

Documents/Aerosoft/A330 Professional folder.

 

[Detail50 17]

Sorry Dave,  windows updated overnight so Sim was not running this morning.   Only thing we have is the video file.

[DaveCT2003 2553]

No worries my friend, if or when it happens again then and please include the route or route files you can include them as well.

 

One question, did you have and us a flight plan for Activesky on that flight?

[Detail50 17]

33 minutes ago, DaveCT2003 said:

No worries my friend, if or when it happens again then and please include the route or route files you can include them as well.

 

One question, did you have and us a flight plan for Activesky on that flight?

Yes,  I had created a flight plan in AS for the flight.  I am doing a short hp in the 320 now,  Paris to Rome.  I have a AS plan loaded for this flight also. I've attached the FPS graph for the flight so far (slider is still on unlimited)

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[DaveCT2003 2553]

Difficult not to be happy with that performance! Just remember that when you fly online to knock it down to as close to 30fps as you can.

 

[Detail50 17]

32 minutes ago, DaveCT2003 said:

Difficult not to be happy with that performance! Just remember that when you fly online to knock it down to as close to 30fps as you can.

 

I've moved the slider to 30

[Detail50 17]

Dave,   I attempted to fly from KRSW to KATL,   approximately 18 mins from takeoff passing FL320 to a planned level of 36,000, the plane lost control again and went into a A floor.  I recorded in on OBS and you can see it on my twitch channel.   It looked like FPS at the time was stable on it's slider value of 30. As you will see there was no warning.

 

I have the flight on pause,  let me know what you want to do.   Before the event things looked perfect, but as you will see it just went wildly unstable.

 

I was flying A320 with no AS or Navigraph.

[Detail50 17]

Dave,   I regain control of the aircraft and complete the balance of the flight without event.   I noticed as the aircraft gets closer to the airport that the FPS sinks to 20 FPS,  but it still maintains control.

 

I want to see if I can do the update this morning as I could not do it yesterday, so I'm going to log off this flight.

 

Other than that one glitch,  it performs as it should be.   The remaining problem is this loss of control event, and using long haul aircraft it could be several hours before you come back to your PC.

[Detail50 17]

I completed two flights after the 1.0.0.7 upgrade with A330.   One flight was without AS and Navigraph on,  the next with both back on.   KRSW to KATL.   Both ran successfully with no loss of control events.

 

Sorry for the dark screen shot,  but I do have a question for Dave.   As you can see on the ND there was a tight turn during final.    I was tempted to click the APPR button at about this point, but I was waited for the localizer alive callout.  Aircraft then got above the glide path and I had to then manually get the plane down to the runway.  My question is should I have clicked APPR sooner so I'm making sure I'm approaching GP from below in this instance? 

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[mopperle 4162]

Yes, maybe you where to late. The FCOM ingeneral says. "When cleared for the ILS, the APPR pb should be pressed."

[DaveCT2003 2553]

I see what you question is Ray, please provide me with the entire Route and which runway/STAR/transitions you used.