Checklists Lights - Revisit

[skwal 9]

In regards to lights at night ..... I have talked to Air Canada pilot and Aeroflot - All of them said that:
1. They never turn on taxi lights right after or during the " before taxi checklist".
2. They never turn on landing lights right after "before takeoff checklist".

 

Lights are turned on manually:
For taxi (Taxi lights): Right after the push is complete aircraft is cleared to taxi, they could sometimes do before taxi checklist while tug is still attached if the push is long (generally is for heavies) so they dont want to blind the people in the tug or those around.
For takeoff (Take off lights): Right after aircraft was cleared for takeoff and is past the hold short runway marks or is on the runway. They do "before takeoff checklist" before they are cleared for take off, About a minute or two so they have enough time to also brief the cabin.

 

I own a bunch of videos from SAS(JP), SWISS,(JP and PilotsEYE) Air Canada(JP), Lufthansa(PilotsEYE).... all of them utilize the lights as I have stated.

 

Please make lights on the ground a manual thing rather than automated. Its silly and unrealistic.

 

You have stated (before locking my other thread) that after consulting pilots it depends on airline and region. Please tell me which one turns on taxi lights before they are cleared to taxi and which one turns on landing lights during before taxi checklist, for example holding short of the runway because I want to hear which Airline risks forcing planes to do a Go-Around as incoming place mights see aircraft turning on landing lights while they are on taxiway.

 

Current workaround (for example for VATSIM), is : Tower clears me to taxi, then I start doing before taxi checklist (couple of times controller asked me if everything is ok and why im not taxing). And for landing I do before takeoff checklist right after being cleared for takeoff (delaying the arrivals slightly, forced go around twice as I was asked to take off with no delay).

 

I fixed the checklist to not turn on taxi/landing light during version 1.0.0.4 but 1.0.0.5 overwrote it and I ain't planning on spending hours once again figuring out how to make the checklists work my way.

 

Please, don't lock this tread right way if someone replies "....This is how it is....."    Prove your point to me (video should be good enough), make me acknowledge the fact that most major airlines utilize the ground lights as you say..... then you can lock it.

 

Lastly if not too much trouble, if all world airlines do it differently from SAS, AC, SWISS and Lufthansa .... can someone on your team please help me edit (or better provide an edited version of) checklist.xml where landing and taxi lights are not touched by the copilot. Someone who built the checklist should be able to do it in 30min at most.

 

Thanks for the attention.

[Hanse 216]

1.  TAXI: Normally the lights (NOSE and RWYTO) are set when reading the TAXI CL and that is when the plane is already moving. At this time the AFTER ENGINE START CL has already been finished (as well as previously the Pushback itself). Only during dawn, dusk and night the lights are already switched on before the plane starts to move / taxi - and in both cases at this time there are no more people around which could be blinded. The only concession I am willing to make is to "couple" this also to a movement of the plane and not anymore just to the availibility of the TAXI CL.
2. BEFORE TAKEOFF: Normally the Landing Lights are switched on when takeoff clearance has been obtained. But because this is not part of the simulation we included it into the Before Takeoff CL. But I agree that this is not the best solution. Therefore I will remove the Landing Lights from this CL. It means if you like, you can switch those lights on manually at any time. But there are users who feel different and therefore we need also an automatic solution. Therefore the Landing Lights automatically will be switched on if after the BEFORE TAKEOFF CL has been finished the plane starts to move again.     

[skwal 9]

1 hour ago, Hanse said:

1.  TAXI: Normally the lights (NOSE and RWYTO) are set when reading the TAXI CL and that is when the plane is already moving. At this time the AFTER ENGINE START CL has already been finished (as well as previously the Pushback itself). Only during dawn, dusk and night the lights are already switched on before the plane starts to move / taxi - and in both cases at this time there are no more people around which could be blinded. The only concession I am willing to make is to "couple" this also to a movement of the plane and not anymore just to the availibility of the TAXI CL.
2. BEFORE TAKEOFF: Normally the Landing Lights are switched on when takeoff clearance has been obtained. But because this is not part of the simulation we included it into the Before Takeoff CL. But I agree that this is not the best solution. Therefore I will remove the Landing Lights from this CL. It means if you like, you can switch those lights on manually at any time. But there are users who feel different and therefore we need also an automatic solution. Therefore the Landing Lights automatically will be switched on if after the BEFORE TAKEOFF CL has been finished the plane starts to move again.     

 TAXI: Agreed but lights are switched on right after pilot says "Before taxi checklist complete" , you might have not necessarily received taxi clearance. And all pilots switch on taxi lights when only cleared to taxi.

BEFORE TAKEOFF: Agreed, but in my sim .... landing lights are switched on during the before taxi checklist not in the end and not when its done .... during. To prove that if you look at the checklist XML and before takeoff section:

    <!-- Exterior Lights -->
....
    (L:AB_VC_OVH_ExtLight_Nose_Sw, number) 2 == &amp;&amp;
    (L:AB_VC_OVH_ExtLight_Landing_Sw, number) 1 == &amp;&amp;
....

 

That piece is right smack in the middle of the checklist. And from what i've seen in paper checklists .... landing lights are never part of it.

 

Also, checklists break if I remove any of the sections from them.

[Hanse 216]

TAXI: In the current version the lights are switched on during TAXI CL and when the plane is moving more than 10 knots. And this moment is determined by the pilot after he got taxi clearance. So everything is fine. In the new version (to be released with the next experimental update) only at dawn, dusk and night the lights are automatically switched on prior to the start of the TAXI CL and when the plane starts to move. And this moment also is determined by the pilot after receiving taxi clearance.

LANDING LIGHTS: As already mentioned above I will remove the landing lights from the BEFORE TAKE OFF CL. Those automatically will be switched on after the checklist has been finished and the plane starts to move. This change also will be part of the new version (to be released with the next experimental update) - have a look into the release notes.

 

[skwal 9]

Thanks @Hanse, I can live with the TAXI option. For the landing lights, would it be possible for you to PM me a checklist XML, where my landing lights will be removed from automated checklist and so that the checklist will not break. (if possible)

[Hanse 216]

No, I will not prepare a special CL just for you because I think it is not necessary. In the new versionding the landing lights have been removed from the BEFORE TO CL as suggested. This has also been confirmed by the RL pilots we have in our team e. g. that those lights are not part of this checklist. As this CL manually can be started p.e. at the holding point you are able to manually switch those on after the CL has been completed and before the plane starts to move on the runway. If the lights are on before the plane starts to move nothing will happen. If not manually switched on those will automatically be switched on if the plane starts to move.

 

Discussion closed!

[skwal 9]

Sounds good. You can close the topic.

[Hanse 216]

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