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DarkBasic

strange "wiggle" while start and landing

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Hello there,

 

I have a annoying "wiggle" effect with the experimental version of the plane. I think its since v1.2.3.1 and tested and confirmed with current 1.2.3.6.

 

 

I have figured out that the effect start after lift-off and ends when you lower the thrust to Climb and Flaps set to 1.

The same wiggle will come back when landing, again in the last phase before touchdown. I only tried to land with this 2 times, so I cant say much about it.

 

In 1.2.3.0 its working ok, so I'm currently stuck at this version.

 

Some more facts?

P3D v4.4

affecting both airbus packaged, means A318/19 and A320/21.

 

 

I have no clue about this.

Hope aanyone can help.

 

 

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TBH never seen something like this before. As this also seems to happen while rolling on the runway, I guess that another tool is influencing the aircraft. What other tools are you using beside scenery addons, like weather, camera tools and other "immersion" tools?

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Hey,

 

during rolling on the runway its just the camera shaking effect from ChasePlane.

Usually I have Active Sky for weather, but it wasnt running in this clip.

For controlls I use the XBox One controller via USB cable. (I know it sounds weird, but it works good for me)

There is nothing else configured to these axis.

 

I tested it multiple times, in 1.2.3.0 all works fine, updating to latest experimental and this happens again.

Then installing the stable again and all works normal again...

No other configurations changed during testing.

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The frames drops a little during the shaking.

The rest of the flight is fine regardless of the frames until it begins in approach again.

I have 20 to 35 fps during flight depending on scenery.

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vor 1 minute, mopperle sagte:

What happens when you turn off chaseplane?

 

same behavior.

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I also see this behaviour on final approach. I use active sky for weather and gsx2. No other non-scenery add-ons. My frame rates are always above the famous AS 18fps limit.

Phil

 

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vor 18 Minuten, Phil Reynolds sagte:

My frame rates are always above the famous AS 18fps limit.

What you mean?? Is there a min. required Framerate??

 

I test it yet again with all possible addons deactivated.

Only FSUIPC and RAAS are active.

No GSX, no weather, no camera.

 

Will report later.

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Could it be that an FSUIPC setting is to blame?

 

For as long as I can remember, I consistently experience the [previously reported] superficially similar behavior on short final, sometime after initially capturing the ILS, where the aircraft will suddenly bank from side to side as if the ILS signal momentarily cuts out (regardless of landing airport quality i.e. default vs. high-end payware) but nothing even remotely near the magnitude of this.

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To see if this is framerate relates is easy to check, just set all your slider to the minimum and check again.  Using the FPS counter in the sim is NOT a reliable way of checking on this as it will often totally ignore one or two seconds of low fps while large sections of scenery are loaded. Certainly, some cfg tweaks can cause this.

 

What the video shows is very typical behavior when the FBW systems can't be calculated enough. In the video, a jerky framerate is actually rather visible.

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I made a whole startup video, also showing the settings as Mathijs commented.

When you want to see only the take-off skip to 14m 25s.

You can see in the bottom left I barely used the Joystick, only to correct to not drifting away to much.

 

I dont know, I dont really think this is FPS related, the effect is to regular.

I watched the recording in slow-motion and found here and there a FPS drop under 20, but since this dont happen in pre-1.2.3.0, I have a slightly hope that this is fixable.

 

 

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We will keep an eye on it but at this moment simply no other reason then fps. Any idea why your system drops down to sub 20 fps on the lowest settings?  That seems rather strange and still suggests to me that there are moments our calculations simply can't keep up. They are done on a frame by frame base.

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15 minutes ago, Mathijs Kok said:

We will keep an eye on it but at this moment simply no other reason then fps. Any idea why your system drops down to sub 20 fps on the lowest settings?  That seems rather strange and still suggests to me that there are moments our calculations simply can't keep up. They are done on a frame by frame base.

 

I believe the Boss is correct, this appears frame rate related.  If you've turned your graphics settings (sliders) in P3D all the way to the left (minimum setting) and you're still seeing this then there is something with your computer, computer settings, P3D settings, Shaders, NVIDIA settings, NVIDIA Inspector Tweaks, or P3D Tweaks.  Do you have anything in that list that is non-standard (not default)?

 

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I havnt found the source of these micro stuttering yet, and my biggest concern is that the sim dont utilising my whole CPU on start. When airborne a couple of minutes it uses 80-90%.

My sim is not tweaked or something, only the given settings in the sim are used.

Shaders are ENVSHADE, I will try changing and/or reverting these.

Anything else is pretty default.

 

For now I revert the Airplane back to 1.2.3.0 to be able to fly on the weekend, I will test this again next week.

Thanks for your help for now. Any suggestsions are still welcome.

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Keep the Task Manager open as you fly and try to see if there is another process that occasionally eats up a lot of CPU. 
Quick question, you on HD or SSD? If you are on HD it could simply be the fact the scenery has to be loaded. That happens as you get close to an airport and after yoy take-off and your field of vision increase dramatically.

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The sim and all related addons are on one dedicated SATA SSD.

OS on another smaller SATA SSD.

A third SATA SSD for regular Games and a big HDD for stuff.

 

Scenery: I only have landclass from OrbX and FS Global NG for mesh.

So currently no "fancy" airports or other big sceneries installed.

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Okay then keep checking the Task Manager, there really should be no reason your sim should get below 20 fps with this little to display. 

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Mathijs, is there any possibility of updating the code to allow these momentary drops in FPS? In other words, some kind of smoothing routine that will keep the wings from banking back and forth without control input when frame rates drop momentarily. It sounds like it would be do-able, at least to my non-programmer mind - maybe locking the ailerons/spoilers in their current position? I know you mentioned that it's the way the A3xx is coded, it is tied to frame rate and you wished it wasn't so. I think we wouldn't mind some choppy visuals if frames dropped in dense scenery areas, but this seems to be unique to the Aerosoft Airbus - the same situation with FSL or PMDG doesn't exhibit this wild rocking behavior.

 

I DO like flying this airplane - just wish I could leave the sliders higher.

 

Randy

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4 hours ago, DarkBasic said:

The sim and all related addons are on one dedicated SATA SSD.

OS on another smaller SATA SSD.

A third SATA SSD for regular Games and a big HDD for stuff.

 

Scenery: I only have landclass from OrbX and FS Global NG for mesh.

So currently no "fancy" airports or other big sceneries installed.

 

Can you please post your system specs?

 

 

1 hour ago, RRVyper said:

Mathijs, is there any possibility of updating the code to allow these momentary drops in FPS? In other words, some kind of smoothing routine that will keep the wings from banking back and forth without control input when frame rates drop momentarily. It sounds like it would be do-able, at least to my non-programmer mind - maybe locking the ailerons/spoilers in their current position? I know you mentioned that it's the way the A3xx is coded, it is tied to frame rate and you wished it wasn't so. I think we wouldn't mind some choppy visuals if frames dropped in dense scenery areas, but this seems to be unique to the Aerosoft Airbus - the same situation with FSL or PMDG doesn't exhibit this wild rocking behavior.

 

I DO like flying this airplane - just wish I could leave the sliders higher.

 

Randy

 

The aircraft is tied (software wise) to the FPS, so there is really nothing that we can do in this area.

 

With that in mind, the aircraft flies very smoothly so long as ones system is capable of maintaining 18fps or better.  In fact, with the Airbus Pro I believe the required FPS to prevent the wild banking is more like 15FPS, it was 18FPS back with the previous 32-bit Airbus.

 

Even one setting can result in reduced frame rates, so it's important that people take a careful look at their settings.  I recommend not using NVIDIA Inspector and third party shaders with P3Dv4 as they have been continually shown to create problems with high-end airliners.

 

Best wishes!

 

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vor 10 Stunden , DaveCT2003 sagte:

Can you please post your system specs?

 

CPU: AMD FX8350 @ 4.7 GHz (4 cores, 8 threads)

RAM: 4x 8GB DDR3-1600 MHz

GPU: nVidia GTX 1080Ti (chip @ 2025 MHz, mem @ 5600 MHz)

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15 hours ago, RRVyper said:

Mathijs, is there any possibility of updating the code to allow these momentary drops in FPS? In other words, some kind of smoothing routine that will keep the wings from banking back and forth without control input when frame rates drop momentarily. It sounds like it would be do-able, at least to my non-programmer mind - maybe locking the ailerons/spoilers in their current position? I know you mentioned that it's the way the A3xx is coded, it is tied to frame rate and you wished it wasn't so. I think we wouldn't mind some choppy visuals if frames dropped in dense scenery areas, but this seems to be unique to the Aerosoft Airbus - the same situation with FSL or PMDG doesn't exhibit this wild rocking behavior.

 

 

Sorry totally impossible without at least 6 man-months of work and we would end up with code that is more demanding on hardware.

I would focus on trying to find out why you get sub 20 fps at minimal settings, should be a solvable problem.

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17 hours ago, DaveCT2003 said:

 

The aircraft is tied (software wise) to the FPS, so there is really nothing that we can do in this area.

 

With that in mind, the aircraft flies very smoothly so long as ones system is capable of maintaining 18fps or better.  In fact, with the Airbus Pro I believe the required FPS to prevent the wild banking is more like 15FPS, it was 18FPS back with the previous 32-bit Airbus.

 

Even one setting can result in reduced frame rates, so it's important that people take a careful look at their settings.  I recommend not using NVIDIA Inspector and third party shaders with P3Dv4 as they have been continually shown to create problems with high-end airliners.

 

Best wishes!

 

 

Thanks, Dave. I agree with your assessment and will dial things back a bit with the Airbus. I haven't yet tried any 3rd party shaders but do have some basic adjustments in NVI. Maybe I'll have a look there.

 

3 hours ago, Mathijs Kok said:

 

Sorry totally impossible without at least 6 man-months of work and we would end up with code that is more demanding on hardware.

I would focus on trying to find out why you get sub 20 fps at minimal settings, should be a solvable problem.

 

Ok. Thanks for the explanation, Mathijs. I never said I used minimal settings - they are moderate to high, on fairly decent hardware. I guess my point was they are acceptable settings when using other high-end aircraft. Also, I wasn't looking for a total rewrite, just a tweak. 😉

 

Randy

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10 hours ago, DarkBasic said:

 

CPU: AMD FX8350 @ 4.7 GHz (4 cores, 8 threads)

RAM: 4x 8GB DDR3-1600 MHz

GPU: nVidia GTX 1080Ti (chip @ 2025 MHz, mem @ 5600 MHz)

 

If I'm reading that correctly, it looks like your CPU and GPU are both overclocked including your VRAM.  I would try reducing both your CPU and GPU overclock a bit, that has been known to cause issues with bottlenecking, timeouts and CTDs.

 

While keeping in mind the different architecture of AMD and Intel CPUs, I believe the very best processor speed to run P3D at is 4.5GHz (4.3 isn't bad at all either).  I've run at 4.7GHz (stable) and did not see any improvements. 

 

 

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4 hours ago, RRVyper said:

Ok. Thanks for the explanation, Mathijs. I never said I used minimal settings - they are moderate to high, on fairly decent hardware. I guess my point was they are acceptable settings when using other high-end aircraft. Also, I wasn't looking for a total rewrite, just a tweak. 😉

 

 

Randy, our calculations are done on a frame by frame base. That is by far the most efficient way and it makes it possible for us to get the framerate we need. We have used this for the last 8 years and we have seen posts like yours for every version of the add-on and the sim. But with your hardware, it simply should NOT be a problem, there is another factor in play.  For some reason, your framerate drops below what is needed (around 10 fps in cruise and 17 fps while doing complex stuff) and the FBW gets behind the curve. That only needs to happen for a second, if you see it in your framerate counter it most likely lasts 2 or 3 seconds. Keep in mind we sold tens of thousands of copies. If all these people had the issue you see these forums would look very different. 

 

I have helped a few people with these issues. Sometimes it is RAID driver in the bios that checks the disks every few seconds while there is no RAID system, often it is things like indexing of media files (why the hell do some tools do that every 10 seconds?), a backup tool that checks for changed files way too often. But it can be a lot of things. 

 

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