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Mathijs Kok

Aerosoft A318/A319/A320/A321/A330 Professional Preview (part 4)

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vor 7 Minuten, Trevor Hannant sagte:

Please don't get me wrong here but while all the enhancements to what was available in the previous version look great and will be welcomed by the majority of simmers, I can't help thinking that perhaps this may have been looked at in a different way.

 

With the number of simmers who've moved to P3Dv4 growing and eagerly awaiting the updated Airbus series, would there not have been a good argument to get the core product out with the reworked code but on a feature list that was on par with the older product initially, saving all the enhancements (dimmable lights, printer etc) for a Service Pack/update release?   Apart from getting money in the door sooner, you could benefit from a plethora of "pre-upgrade testing" from simmers on the core before all the new stuff was added (then effectively re-tested on that release) giving you less of a codebase to troubleshoot against?

 

Or is that just me...?

 

Maybe. But you can always fly something else until the busses are out. ;)

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Great news guys! Fantastic work!

Now only wingflex is missing for the apocalypse to happen. 

Just kidding, cheers. 

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Excellent news about the popup panels, while they might not be "realistic", they do simulate the eye movement toward the CDU/gauge, which in real life is a lot less cumbersome than changing view.

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14 hours ago, Trevor Hannant said:

Please don't get me wrong here but while all the enhancements to what was available in the previous version look great and will be welcomed by the majority of simmers, I can't help thinking that perhaps this may have been looked at in a different way.

 

With the number of simmers who've moved to P3Dv4 growing and eagerly awaiting the updated Airbus series, would there not have been a good argument to get the core product out with the reworked code but on a feature list that was on par with the older product initially, saving all the enhancements (dimmable lights, printer etc) for a Service Pack/update release?   Apart from getting money in the door sooner, you could benefit from a plethora of "pre-upgrade testing" from simmers on the core before all the new stuff was added (then effectively re-tested on that release) giving you less of a codebase to troubleshoot against?

 

Or is that just me...?

 

If you check you will see this has been discussed a few times. It simply was technically not easy, would have taken a lot of time and all that time would have been lost working on a complete version. We have never been fans of 'just get it working' updates.

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13 hours ago, Gantalyetos said:

Great news guys! Fantastic work!

Now only wingflex is missing for the apocalypse to happen. 

Just kidding, cheers. 

 

Also do not get me wrong, but sometimes the communications by AS is rather... strange. The repeatedly published reason for not implementing wing-flex always was the non-proportional workload to adjust the model with wingflex and then the release is postponed and postponed and what we see in the preview thread is the implementation of gimmicks such as raindrops on the windshield, dimmable lights, virtual printers in the virtual cockpit and all of those extremely nice little details that will enhance immersion without doubt. But it basically renders the explanation why wingflex will not be included rather ridiculous... Why not simply communicate more straight forward? Like: "no, wingflex will not be included. Our aim is to give as much immersion as possible for the pilot flying this bird. He sits in the VC and that's where we put our focus on: a VC with so far unpreceded detail to enhance immersion." Point. And end of discussion.

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Ahhhh not again.... if you check back to at least 20 topics you see your explanation is simply not correct. 

 

Gents, the A320 series will NOT have wingflex, it never did, it never will. If you want to know why, search the forum. It has little to do with the amount of work however. The A330, with it's MUCH bigger and MUCH more flexible wings will have flex. 

 

So please let's put this to bed.

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Any chance at looking at overhauling the wing view sound?, As in making it a bit quieter/deeper like the inside if the cabin would be, 

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vor 2 Stunden , WatkinTench sagte:

Any chance at looking at overhauling the wing view sound?, As in making it a bit quieter/deeper like the inside if the cabin would be, 

Agree

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On 11/28/2017 at 7:21 PM, mach533x said:

The whole true light and true glass may not seem that important. but when youre in the sim it honestly adds to the immersion for me anyway. I always feel a little more stressed when i fly int he rain in my cessna at school, now simming at home and you actually have good rain textures. i can feel that same stress. albeit its fun unlike at school where im getting graded. haha   

 

But everything looks great! :) 

 

Agreed. Flying a 172 in the rain is a challenge.  Flying in the rain at night takes that challenge to a whole new level.  That view changes a bunch from day to night and with higher speeds - say 240kts 

 

True glass rain effect I think stems from what FSW had to show off at the last FlightSimCon.  That was the one thing that FSW had brought to the table and I must say it was pretty amazing. Everyone took note. 

 

There were some problems I felt. It just didnt look real by a tad....hard to put a finger on without some time to study.  Speed changes throughout all phases of flight also left me with questions on how the water reacted. There are some videos out showing it in the 717, but its hard to tell there as well what its really going to look like. 

 

Yes, the sims (addons) have needed to do a better job with glass and rain effect and I'm sure Mathijs will not let it into the final sim without a firm stamp of approval.  Just hope there's a way to turn it off if it drags system performance down or an exaggerated, possibly artificial, depiction of the effect becomes an annoyance. 

 

That said, I'm holding my water ;) to see it in the airplane, so hurry up show us some stuff!                         Please.

 

 

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22 hours ago, Mathijs Kok said:

We just had our weekly dev meeting and next to a lot of small staff we have also decided to make 2d panels (in the same style as the CRJ has) possible. We might have a way that makes the lit up correctly so only the perspective is weird. 

 

Over all things are going really well at this moment. A lot of the lighting in the cockpit is now redone. When that is complete the modelers will start on the windshield stuff.

 

Fantastic news. Thank you. Regards.

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I'll put in my 2¢ worth of wishful features...high-res "framed" passenger window views (this view is sometimes done in low-res with other aircraft) and high-resolution "4K" exterior textures which are common on another developer's civil/business aircraft. Yes, I know the VC/interior is now 2K.

 

Just a wish, Darryl

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Gents as explained we base our products on the task of the captain and have very little interest in enjoying the simulator as a passenger. When is the last time you seen a pilot walking the cabin?

 

We also do not believe 4K textures make any sense at this moment. Keep in mind that 4K textures are 16 (!) times the workload for the graphics card compared to what we use now. One of the busses is now around 700 Mb. with 4k textures it would be over 6 Gb (how many Gb of mem does your graphics card have?) , the total download of the product would be over 90 Gb. And to be honest, we feel our exterior (and the 2000+) repaints looks pretty good. 

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23 hours ago, Mathijs Kok said:

We just had our weekly dev meeting and next to a lot of small staff we have also decided to make 2d panels (in the same style as the CRJ has) possible. We might have a way that makes the lit up correctly so only the perspective is weird. 

 

Over all things are going really well at this moment. A lot of the lighting in the cockpit is now redone. When that is complete the modelers will start on the windshield stuff.

 

Mathijs, can you confirm the current view system will remain intact? For instance the default views are pretty good and the view bar system is very convenient instead of using the A and S keys.

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30 minutes ago, AA777-200ER said:

I'll put in my 2¢ worth of wishful features...high-res "framed" passenger window views (this view is sometimes done in low-res with other aircraft) and high-resolution "4K" exterior textures which are common on another developer's civil/business aircraft. Yes, I know the VC/interior is now 2K.

 

Just a wish, Darryl

 

13 minutes ago, Mathijs Kok said:

Gents as explained we base our products on the task of the captain and have very little interest in enjoying the simulator as a passenger. When is the last time you seen a pilot walking the cabin?

 

We also do not believe 4K textures make any sense at this moment. Keep in mind that 4K textures are 16 (!) times the workload for the graphics card compared to what we use now. One of the busses is now around 700 Mb. with 4k textures it would be over 6 Gb (how many Gb of mem does your graphics card have?) , the total download of the product would be over 90 Gb. And to be honest, we feel our exterior (and the 2000+) repaints looks pretty good. 

 

Mathijs, what's wrong with my window view suggestion (you already have various views built into the simulator) and the 4K suggestion creates no problems, been using these textures for years in FSX and Prepar3d in aircraft such as 757's and the aforementioned business/civil aircraft with a lower-end system.

 

 

Not everyone (in this hobby) wants to be a captain all-of-the-time, my other passion is screen-shots/photography...Darryl 

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There is nothing wrong with the wingview, we just do not want to spend time on it. There are indeed wingviews in the project, but in fact they came from a bit that we added to the project made by other people. 

 

And if you are happy with 4K textures and feel they are worthwhile, great. I tried them and only saw a lot more memory used (of course), lower framerate (of course) and never seen any real benefit. Btw, of course 1K or 4K textures say nothing on resolution. A 1K texture on a C172 will have won more detail then a 4K texture on an Airbus. If you compare aircraft you will often see we use smaller objects so 1K textures stay sharp.

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We decided to go for 2K textures for the VC because the better resolution on limited shapes gives us a bit more sharpness and better fps because less texture bitmaps are loaded (again 1K, 2K or 4K say nothing on how detailed something looks if you don't take the surface area into account). No changes are planned for the exterior, again mainly because we believe they are not outdated and because it would make 2000+ repaints incompatible.

 

a320-a321%20(2).jpg

a320-a321%20(13).jpg

 

 

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vor 2 Stunden , Mathijs Kok sagte:

Gents as explained we base our products on the task of the captain and have very little interest in enjoying the simulator as a passenger. When is the last time you seen a pilot walking the cabin?

Sorry to pick up on this topic again, but I strongly disagree with you in this aspect. I do believe that a lot of people enjoy their real life flights and would love to hear these sounds back in the simulator.

 

I understand that you want to keep the main focus on the actual job of the pilot, but why do you have an exterior view and sound system then? From my experience pilots usually don't do their Outside Check in mid-air! 

 

You could atleast do a survey on this topic. I think Aerosoft is missing some customers there, which would be a pity...

 

Also, you don't even need to implement a completely new sound pack. There are already interior sound packs by BSS for instance. Just add an option so the user may decide on his own if he wants the exterior or the interior sounds on the wing views. 

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4 minutes ago, datguytho said:

Sorry to pick up on this topic again, but I strongly disagree with you in this aspect. I do believe that a lot of people enjoy their real life flights and would love to hear these sounds back in the simulator.

 

I understand that you want to keep the main focus on the actual job of the pilot, but why do you have an exterior view and sound system then? From my experience pilots usually don't do their Outside Check in mid-air! 

 

You could atleast do a survey on this topic. I think Aerosoft is missing some customers there, which would be a pity...

 

Also, you don't even need to implement a completely new sound pack. There are already interior sound packs by BSS for instance. Just rewrite the code so the user may decide on his own if he wants the exterior or the interior sounds on the wing views. 

 

With several hundred thousand people who purchase flight sim products, there are bound to be a few who would like to see a passenger simulator. In fact, we've been asked to produce aircraft with flight attendents, trays that move, just about everything you can think of.  

 

We value your input, but the more things we add to each aircraft the more it will impact the performance, not to mention the additional expense to us will translate to addition increase int he cost to our customers.  On top that, we simply can't produce a product which meets with everyone's desires as we'd simply never finish the product.  Moreover, when coming up with a product and development plan we have to set limits while ensuring we meet the expectations of the majority of our target market. So while we truly value your input, the answer will have to be somewhere in between "not at this time" to "sorry, that doesn't fit into our development and marketing plans".

 

Thanks again for your input, it is very much appreciated.

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, datguytho said:

Sorry to pick up on this topic again, but I strongly disagree with you in this aspect. I do believe that a lot of people enjoy their real life flights and would love to hear these sounds back in the simulator.

 

Ahh well. It is impossible to make a product that will please everybody and we do make our own choices. I have no idea if there are other A320 that do what you feel should be in and add-on like this but it could be ours is not the one you want to buy.

 

My personal idea is really simple. It is a simulator designed to allow you to fly the aircraft. Not to be passenger, not to be maintenance engineer and not to be a simulation of a simulation that trains pilots to handle emergencies. So I do not care about the fuel panel that the person who fills the tank uses sees (the pilot never sees that), and I do not think animated engine covers make a lot of sense because a pilot never open the engine covers. etc etc. 

 

And yes, there is the issue that we are forced to add things that are not fully really in line with this idea. But the pilot DOES walk around the aircraft so he does see that. If you feel it is unrealistic if you can see it in flight I suggest you stay in the VC.  There are more things, we would  like to remove the flaps sounds from the sound set because in flight you simply do not hear that. But customers simply expect to hear it. So it is balance between realism and what customers expect.

 

We do not make products based on surveys. We do market research and that is pretty extensive. But that ends in a decision that we (or rather, I) make. You decide if you want to buy it or not! As said, if you feel these things should be part of the add-on I hope you will find one that has that. We rather spend our time to make the VC look as good as possible and to add the things there that make it look as realistic as possible. From the most advanced MCDU ever done for an Airbus add-on to the coffee the pilots drink. 

 

I like to close the discussion about this with this. It has been discussed to death at least five times and all that can be said has been said five times. A quick search will dig that all up and will save us a lot of repetition.

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On ‎29‎-‎11‎-‎2017 at 5:07 PM, Mathijs Kok said:

We just had our weekly dev meeting and next to a lot of small staff we have also decided to make 2d panels (in the same style as the CRJ has) possible. We might have a way that makes the lit up correctly so only the perspective is weird. 

 

Over all things are going really well at this moment. A lot of the lighting in the cockpit is now redone. When that is complete the modelers will start on the windshield stuff.

 

Sorry to ask the question agian, but I guess it was overlooked in the duiscussion. Mathijs, can you confirm the current view system will remain intact? For instance the default views are pretty good and the view bar system is very convenient instead of using the A and S keys. I really liked that part of the aircraft and really helped in the transition from 2D panels to VC.

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5 minutes ago, Er!k said:

Sorry to ask the question agian, but I guess it was overlooked in the duiscussion. Mathijs, can you confirm the current view system will remain intact? For instance the default views are pretty good and the view bar system is very convenient instead of using the A and S keys. I really liked that part of the aircraft and really helped in the transition from 2D panels to VC.

 

Yes.

 

Best wishes.

 

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Thanks Dave! Looking forward to the new buses. Feeling cold Turkey after my P3D migration of May...

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