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DJB

Delta CRJ700/900 Colors

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The Delta CRJ's BLUE COLOR could be darker on the original installers. I noticed there has been paint requests showing pictures in this forum other then the original.

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Not according to the color samples we took from their own website. We assume they use company defined colors for these things. Where does your information come from? You got up to date color calibrated images?

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Most colors will be off if users don't have there monitors calibrated correctly. P3D HDR can really change the color look.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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Correct, even if you got the correct RGB values or RAL numbers, they will look different as long as you do not have a highend hardware calibrated monitor. And to add, never compare pictures from the web with what you see in your sim.

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Even without the P3D HDR you will still see a colordifference between the texture file and what you see inside the sim.


Making it look 100% right for all users is just impossible, just like it is (almost) impossible to get two pictures of the same real aircraft to show exactly the same colors.

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Delta web does show a color similiar to original installer. I was just comparing it to AS Airbus livery repaints that I have previously used. Also the various AI aircraft used are of a darker blue. I use Ultimate Traffic Live with

my P3DV4 install.

 

I have a repaint of TFDI B717 that is darker then there original installer. 

 

Not a big deal. I just wanted to know what was out there that would match my AI traffic.

45a827496a0a9e507735bf02f1278469_XL.jpg

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Speaking from a seasoned painter's perspective, one of the hardest things to do is correctly match darker colors from what we see in the real world compared to how flightsim renders them.

In this particular case, the blue that Delta lists as the official color renders too light in flightsim when applied as a flat color (more on that in a minute).  This is not unique to Delta...in fact many airline's official dark colors do not render perfectly as a direct port into flightsim.

One of the reasons is that the light rendering engine in FS can't accurately recreate the "shininess" that is built into a dark color's pigment (this is the key).  When we put any dark color on a texture map, the best FS can do it put a shiny coat over it and the reflections you see are result of a "clear coat" over that flat color.

To visualize a real world example:

Get a piece of metal, paint half of it with a flat, dark color. Then spray a clear coat over it to get the "surface" shiny.  Then get that same paint color, but as a glossy paint. Spray that on to the other half of the metal.  Let dry.

Now take the metal sheet and look at it head-on.  You can of course see the difference right away, and as you tilt it, you'll notice that you still see the "flatness" of the flat paint through the clear coat.  The glossy paint however, infinitely changes shades of that color as it reflects light.  This is what we have in flightsim (the flat paint under a glossy top coat). ;)

 

This is one reason I still do photo textures when painting a livery with dark colors, especially on the tail.  It is not the only way to tackle this issue, but that's how I do it. :)

I know painter's are limited to what they can see from web pictures if they are not able to view that livery with their own eyes due to geographical limitations.  I have hundred's of flights on Delta, lived and flew out of Atlanta for 15 years (mostly on Delta)...so I've seen this livery extensively in the real world.

The only time their official color renders correctly (in my opinion) is when its mid-day with clear skies, and the sun is shining directly on the paint at almost a right-angle.  Any other time and it appears in flightsim as too light.

 

And to echo what Emi said....it is impossible to get it right for all simmers...with HDR, brightness/contrast, color temp adjustments, etc for each and every monitor out there! ;)

 

 

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I don't mean to disrespect anyone by dragging this topic up again...but I'm going to have to disagree with the assessment that the Delta blue color looking too light in the sim is an artifact of the sim's light rendering. I did a side by side of the Aerosoft Delta CRJ700 and 900 and clearly, they aren't the same. The 900 is definitely lighter/a different hue:

 

Untitled.thumb.jpg.b33fbcd2be11a57bdb6055dd9c11bb46.jpg

 

The 700 looks OK in the sim (still could be a bit darker IMO, but I'll have to go with Steve on the rendering thing here). But the 900 is definitely not all that close. There was a user doing updated Delta 700/900 liveries and his blue looked great in-sim, but that one isn't available yet. 

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That does look a lot better. I think that is probably the "true" color, i.e. the direct representation of the official Delta color. For some reason the sim itself makes that particular blue a little "hot" or very slightly oversaturated...but definitely better than the original 900 color. The original Aerosoft Delta 900 color was almost faded...or a lighter hue altogether.

 

I'm with @GJL1995...are you planning on making this public?

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I'm happy to make it public if I'm allowed. It's a modified version of the paintkit provided, so I'm not sure who to ask?

 

Here she is in slightly different light..

 

unknown.png

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I'm pretty sure you can just .zip the files up (include a thumbnail and aircraft.cfg details) and upload it to the "Downloads" section that is linked at the top of the forum. Since your modification is a different reg (N800SK vs. N806SK) I don't think there's a problem. I would hazard a guess that it's common for painters to simply modify other paints with due credit given, of course.

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1 hour ago, adamant365 said:

I would hazard a guess that it's common for painters to simply modify other paints with due credit given, of course.

Yes...that is the 2nd part of the process...the first, crucial step is to get permission from them to modify/reuse their work.;)

 

2 hours ago, adamant365 said:

Since your modification is a different reg (N800SK vs. N806SK) I don't think there's a problem

Still a problem. Even though the reg is changed, the rest of the textures (i.e. the rest of the plane) still belongs to someone else, so the same rules for using them apply.

Unless you are creating a new paint from an official paintkit with all the EULA info associated with it (which includes the terms about redistributing and credit stuff), you are essentially painting on someone else's textures.

 

These are things us freeware painters need to be crystal clear on before we release paints to avoid any issues in the future....based on recent events surrounding the topic.

My motto is..."If in doubt, don't roll it out" :lol:

 

Stefan answered my question about modifying the default American Eagle repaints here:

http://forum.aerosoft.com/index.php?/topic/99756-paintkit-downloads/&do=findComment&comment=831818

@Tavers John, I'd speculate that Stefan also painted the Delta paints, but of course we'd need him or another AS representative to chime in here to verify and give permission before you'd be able to upload them.

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Thanks for replying Steve. I guess I was way off. I've never been a painter and I probably should have just kept quiet. 

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Just now, adamant365 said:

Thanks for replying Steve. I guess I was way off. I've never been a painter and I probably should have just kept quiet. 

Naw, its always good to ask questions that I'm sure most are curious about when it comes to repainting....even as painters we still get confused about permissions, intellectual property, credit, etc.

Like I mentioned...a EULA (End User License Agreement ...just in case)...can provide the guidelines for how we use and redistribute our paints, based off an official paintkit.

 

The developer typically includes this document so there is no ambiguity with the rules...and when not present, we either follow the generally accepted rules for repaints, or hold off on release until we either get a EULA for repaint distribution or notification via these forums from an Aerosoft representative. 

 

The American Eagles I released, as you saw, were approved by Stefan, the creator of the AE textures.  Now granted, he is in fact the original creator of ALL textures related to the CRJ, since the modeler typically creates the texture maps as well.  However, when there is an existing livery involved, that may require a separate permission request if the modeler didn't paint that livery (Let's say Holgi painted it).

 

John, being the very experienced painter he is, knows he needs to get the proper permission before releasing a paint that he did not create from scratch. ;)  

Just like as pilots, I actually have a checklist of all the things I need to do before releasing a paint.  Getting permission to use other folk's work is always one of those checklist items. 

 

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If I get the go ahead, I'll upload her :)

 

I modified the spec maps and added some other details here and there too. 

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Well, it's not looking too good. No one has replied thus far.

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5 hours ago, Christian85 said:

When will be releasd ?

 

 


Unfortunately I haven't been able to get consent from the original author (I'm not even sure who it is?), so I don't know

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If the aircraft comes with the CRJ (default aircraft) then please contact Mathijs at support@aerosoft.com (write "Attention Mathijs" at the top of the email) and ask his permission.

 

If the aircraft is a download then it was created by someone else and there will be readme.txt file included in the download with an email address of who to contact.

 

I agree with the blue color issue... and I run a calibrated 4K monitor and x3 calibrated 23" monitors.

 

Best wishes.

 

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Hi @Mathijs Kok I was wondering if you're able to provide the green light to upload an updated Delta 900 repaint based off the paintkit version?

 

Thanks in advance :)

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