airvice 2 Posted November 12, 2016 Share Posted November 12, 2016 There appear to me missing airways between dubai and turkey. Real world commercial pilots tell me that because this route is so busy because they cant fly over syria or iraq there are now numerous airways in both direction between turkey and dubai via iran. There is a corridor of airways to accomodate the heavy traffic. This is also apparant if you look at flight radar where aircraft are flying up the gulf then turning east toward iraq to waypoints and airways that dont seem to exist in pfpx. Is this a nav data issue or a pfpx issue? thanks airvice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deputy Sheriffs Tom A320 4915 Posted November 12, 2016 Deputy Sheriffs Share Posted November 12, 2016 If at all it's a nav data issue. What AIRAC cycle do you have installed? Have you excluded syrian airspace in your route planing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
airvice 2 Posted November 12, 2016 Author Share Posted November 12, 2016 i use the latest airac cycle yes. I also exclude syrian airspace however that shouldnt affect the presence of airways, only the planned routing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deputy Sheriffs Tom A320 4915 Posted November 12, 2016 Deputy Sheriffs Share Posted November 12, 2016 The AIRAC cycles provided by NavDataPro and Navigraph originate from Lufthansa System, i.e. are the most recent real word nav data. Can you give examples of missing waypoints and airways? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
airvice 2 Posted November 12, 2016 Author Share Posted November 12, 2016 unfortunately i cannot give examples because they are not present so i dont know what they are called i only know that im seeing on flight radar and hearing from commercial pilots they have numerous airways skirting to the east of iraq and round the north in iran because this corridor is now the only economic way through the middle east Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FraPre 89 Posted November 12, 2016 Share Posted November 12, 2016 Hi, you can tested the follow routings from AIRAC 1611. For simplicity start at LTBA, then direct to 1. ERN (Erzincan) then UL333 SERKAN (this is from Turkey via Iran to FIR Karachi) 2. UMH (Uromiye) then UL124 KEBUD or G208 KEBUD (this is from Iran to FIR Karachi) 3. UMH (Uromiye) then UL223 KIS (this is from Iran to FIR Muscat) 4. SIV (Sivas) then UP975 TOTIS (this is from Turkey via Irak to UIR Emirates) Frank Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
airvice 2 Posted November 12, 2016 Author Share Posted November 12, 2016 Hi Frank thanks for your info there I do see all those routings and airways however there is really only 1 route there using UL223 that is really appropriate for skirting around syria and iraq without making a massive detour. Pilots say that there is more than one airway paralell with UL223 because of this. No flights are deviating as far west as UL124 and ZAJ, which is also apparant on flight radar 24 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
srcooke 422 Posted November 12, 2016 Share Posted November 12, 2016 Based on your Navigraph post you are not using a current AIRAC so again it is difficult to comment especially without a route. M317 and UT36 run either side of UL223 in AIRAC 1612 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
airvice 2 Posted November 12, 2016 Author Share Posted November 12, 2016 Ok Thanks then i will update my airacs and check this out. The reason i havent bothered updating them is because i did that the last time with the expectation that the additional airways would be present , knowing that they already existed for some time in the real world at that point, however once updated i discovered they were not present still. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deputy Sheriffs Tom A320 4915 Posted November 12, 2016 Deputy Sheriffs Share Posted November 12, 2016 6 hours ago, airvice said: i use the latest airac cycle yes. 36 minutes ago, airvice said: then i will update my airacs and check this out. So this is your understanding of answering questions of people who are trying to help you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
airvice 2 Posted November 12, 2016 Author Share Posted November 12, 2016 ok i have updated the airac and all new airways are now present thats a significant difference from the last time i updated thanks for all your help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
airvice 2 Posted November 12, 2016 Author Share Posted November 12, 2016 8 minutes ago, Tom A320 said: So this is your understanding of answering questions of people who are trying to help you? apologies i wasnt really thinking about it when i wrote that. It was a more complex issue and i meant something else. I was actually referring to the last time i updated the airacs which is actually when i first noticed the airways were missing, yet at the time i knew they existed in the real world so i had updated my airacs to the currant latest versions (at the time) yet the airways were still missing despite that. therefore it was logical that even the latest airacs didnt sem to make any difference Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
srcooke 422 Posted November 12, 2016 Share Posted November 12, 2016 It would have been easier to identify any possible issue at the time rather than three months plus later. As both Navigraph and Aerosoft use official sources of navigation in Jeppesen and LIDO respectively and it would be unlikely that the airways were missing. If they were indeed missing then it would have been noted in the respective alerts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpgmultimodal 61 Posted November 12, 2016 Share Posted November 12, 2016 1 hour ago, srcooke said: Based on your Navigraph post you are not using a current AIRAC so again it is difficult to comment especially without a route. M317 and UT36 run either side of UL223 in AIRAC 1612 As Stephen mentioned; this is from Jeppesen Chart En route cycle 11-2016: Please login to display this image. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
airvice 2 Posted November 12, 2016 Author Share Posted November 12, 2016 59 minutes ago, srcooke said: It would have been easier to identify any possible issue at the time rather than three months plus later. As both Navigraph and Aerosoft use official sources of navigation in Jeppesen and LIDO respectively and it would be unlikely that the airways were missing. If they were indeed missing then it would have been noted in the respective alerts. sure i understand however not really had time to address it since up till now. I dont know weather there may have been some update issue with pfpx that resulted in the airways not being present or displaying in 1604 but they definately didnt show. Hard to say Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuddyDog 40 Posted November 12, 2016 Share Posted November 12, 2016 I think Navigraph transitioned to LIDO last year. My charts are metric, now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
srcooke 422 Posted November 12, 2016 Share Posted November 12, 2016 7 minutes ago, BuddyDog said: I think Navigraph transitioned to LIDO last year. My charts are metric, now. That is incorrect, Navigraph uses Jeppesen data for AIRAC navigation data files. Charts however are Lufthansa LIDO based. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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