EmilG
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Posts posted by EmilG
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I'm downloading the v3.0, and do i have to revert to normal installation with v2.0 ? or simply run the 3.0 and choose ?
download v3, install Default setup. re-run and choose the LITE setup you need.
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Made another test with 2 different fsx.cfg:
- ver. 1 vanilla, with only highmemfix applied
- ver. 2 with Bojote's tweaks:
Result: ver. 2 gave me only a drop of ~200MB versus ver.1 with nearly 1GB
Strange, isn't it?
please drop the tweaks.
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My appologies to Emilios,
After several tries, no more OOM encountered at LGTS. I just had to uncheck vector lights (very greedy apparently) on FTXGlobal.
From all my scenarios, i am now approaching the airport with VAS=3000 which is way enough.
Appologies again Emilios.. This is a fantastic scenery.
Dom
Accepted Dom.
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I see, there is not one files that controls trees. They are blended. Understood.
I am perplexed as to why others have very little VAS footprint and others do not. So goes the PC world huh!? So many combinations of hardware and so on. It is almost impossible to track down.
Now you see the 'troubled' world of the developer who wants to 'push the limits' in FSX (p3dv2.0 is another story-more flexible).
Having NGX always in mind, the ideal testing would involve getting VAS readings on a clean FSX setup. That would be the true VAS load. Then one by one, after each add-on, test again. Try different display settings, test again. This would of course take ages, and the amount of testers that would have to participate, to include all possible add-ons and hardware setup combinations would be more than the actual buying community! inefficient. Our testing team was comprised of experienced simmers with heavy and lighter setups though, who all gave us the green light after a LOT of hard-time (never any OOMs though, just reaching alarming VAS ranges) and optimisation stages which took over 2 months..damn testers..
You see, scenery files are pretty simple, no fancy code or calculations take place. More stuff (polygons&textures) = more memory, pure math. Which is why I' m damn sure some add-on combination and/or hardware setup is interfering and some people are flying the smooth approach with RTM/or LITE, and some others have problems with LITE II.
Bottom line is that when a scenery is at 'fault' and 'unflyable' out of the box, then it is unflyable everywhere, in every setup, no matter what. If however, the great majority of users (believe me this is true) can 'fly' it in the 'lights' and the heavies, then it must be boiling down to individual add-on/hardware (specifically intrigued by the issue with higher spec GPUs..odd) setups that fail to do so. No doubt, this is a heavy scenery, so when you're playing at this level, it is expected that the detail in the setup will be important.
Just because I do understand the need of other add-ons in FS though, I tried to give the extra two LITE options. Especially LITE II, should now allow a lot more space to 'calculate' for the more 'problematic' add-on/hardware setups
Well that was boring enough..
p.s. still waiting for more DLL and EXE files, some are actually 'clogged' with add-ons, which may or may not affect but could increase the risk of running out of memory in heavy environments.
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I don't have FTX (I do have some ORBX areas in NA). Is there one file that controls the trees or a way to remove them?
That's what I meant, we did not add custom autogen models, because 1) it would create many conflicts with other add-ons and 2) the models would not 'blend in'.
There is no other way to control the scenery density other than the patch.
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V3 patch is much better!
But I would still like to know how to disable the autogen trees around the scenery.
There is no autogen in the scenery, everything is controlled from the .BGL files, which we are optimizing from here to deliver the patch versions. You will have noticed the nice blend of the scenery models on top of the terrain, this is because the terrain is 'shaded' to match the overlaying models. This would not be possible with autogen, let alone the 'hell' we'd have gone through if we had our own custom autogen models (thank you FTX).
The autogen slider will only control 3D lights.
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Actually yet another question, will the filename of the new City Configurator reflect it's the new ver 3 so I can know when the file has been updated on the order page without having to download the file several times to find out?
yes..it's named Thessaloniki X City Configurator [v3.0].exe
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This is amazing news, thank you so much for your super quick response to this issue and the provided support - 10 out of 10 Emilios!!
Would also like to add that I fully understand the mixed feelings removing stuff you put lots of time and hard work in but think about it this way...better offering a config tool like the City Configurator letting people enjoy at least most of your great scenery rather than some people will not be able to enjoy it at all.
Just tried downloading the City Configurator from my order page but it's still ver 2 so guess it takes some more time before ver 3 will replace ver 2 on the order page?
Thanks, appreciate that, like said before I do want you to 'fly the scenery' as much as you do. So this patch is the best we can do to allow good visuals and some more room for your other 'goodies'
That's almost a 700mb file, so I guess it'll take some more time.
About procedure. Once you receive v3.0, just run the default setup once. Then, you are free to choose the one you want.
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A new City Congifurator (v3.0) should be at your AS accounts.
The LITE II version is further optimised, keeping visual reduction at minimum possible. From some testing, I gained another 200-300MB on top of the 500MB you gained from v2.0.
On my setup, the lighter version gives me less memory load than FT Dubai.
(I don't own MMMX-cant tell).
With more than 1.1GB of total free space (on the NGX) on our advised settings, we are claiming much less than the '''fair''' VAS for a detailed scenery as this is.-
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10-4 Emil! I will not be at my FSX PC until later this afternoon (Canada).
Also, I notice lots of trees and buildings to the north and east of the airport (not downtown) even with the Lite II configuration. Any way to reduce those in half lets say? I run normal autogen and there is still a pile of these trees and buildings.
EDIT: BTW where do we send these files?
You can attach here or via email to : support@flightsimdevelopmentgroup.com
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Guys, can you please send here your DLL.XML and EXE.XML files which should be located user %APPDATA%\Microsoft\FSX
We can make some good use of those, we can run a few 'diagnostics' on them and provide more help.
Thanks!
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OK, now: I just completed my second flight in the NGX to LGTS with 'Scenery complexity' set to 'normal'. And again from an VAS-intensive origin (Earth Simulations - Isle of Man). At the end, parked in front of the terminal, VAS usage was between 3.7 and 3.8. No OOM, no Windows warning sound or something like this. I even was able to change my aircraft to the Twin Otter Extended and I did a second VFR flight around the city. Can't believe it !!! And I can live with that changed slider setting.
Emil, thanks a lot for your support! My problem is solved and finally I'm able to enjoy everything!
Hi again, glad that this 'by mistake' change in setup fixed your problem
I understand that possibly other add-on sceneries make use of the Scenery Density slider more than we do. If it is set at Ext.Dense before&during the flight it can load up the memory. LGTS is 'insensitive' to that slider, so you can keep it at normal to keep VAS at bay, without loss of our scenery density on final.
(btw: If you want a VFR tour on the Twotter, make sure you reload the Default stuff
)Your other add-ons possibly give you the extra 500Mb above what I have on the NGX (3.1-3.2GB) in my vanilla setup FSX SP2 +REX+UT2.
Now, I remember you have a Mid.1x at water, perhaps a compromise would be the Low2x. LOD should stay=Medium (at least when on the NGX)
Also 3D grass, that's a lot of polygons and a big VAS 'eater'; disabling it can further reduce your VAS load. I would also consider a default fresh FSX.cfg (only keep the HIGHMEMFIX tweak).
We do want you to enjoy this scenery with the NGX as much as you do. When the NGX with its +900MB VAS comes in, and you have another 500-700MB of other add-ons on top, you understand that we are left with very little that we can do to deliver a product of this quality.
We chose to give you almost everything that FSX can do at the moment, (surely P3dv2 can do even more), it just needs some extra time adjusting your FSX setup to give it some 'breathing space' assuming you wish to keep all your other FSX 'goodies'.
@Piper9t3: there are still some 'bugs' within that mode, but i ve came across a few online videos demonstrating DX10 in LGTS, and look good already.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ac1IXTbpJ4M
LGTS on 'heavy addons'
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Just to add up to what Oliver said above. The configuration posted above by me (post 75) gives you 800-1GB (!) of free VAS on the NGX with almost all the eye-candy you want on your approach. That's pretty much what Flytampa's Dubai gives you too.
It's up to you to spend all that free memory by selecting other settings than those advised, multiple add-ons- FTXG, weather, etc..etc.., or whatever else you want.
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Reason we are sure about our product is all about testing, and this has been tested with various diferrent setups.
I will make our results public if need be, but for now here is what LGTS will gives me on a vanilla setup FSX SP2 (+REX)
LITE II configuration ( LITE gives same results +50-100MB)
All options active from our manager tool
I seriously believe that a 800MB-1000MB margin for memory is more than enough.
FSX Settings
VAS READINGS
Loaded at the Apron
ON APPROACH FROM LGAV (FLytampa)
LANDING (important as all the grass models start loading up)
PARKED AT THE APRON
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Yes, it's 'medium'. I have a VAS value of about 2.65 GB when loading a flight with the NGX at LGTS. Of course I've installed the latest updates for everything!
Other important settings:
- Filtering: anisotropic
- Anti-aliasing: on
- Global texture resolution: max
- Aircraft cast shadows on ground: off
- Aircraft cast shadows on itself: off
- Mesh complexity: 50%
- Mesh resolution: 19 m
- Texture resolution: 60 cm
- Water effects: Mid 1.x
- Land detail textures: activated
- Scenery complexity: Extremely Dense
- Autogen density: normal
- Ground scenery shadows: deactivated
- Cloud draw distance: depending on the weather situation, between 96km (slider full left) and 176 km (slider full right)
- Cloud coverage density: max
- Airliner traffic: 30 % (Flight1 UT2 2013)
- General aviation traffic: off
- Airport vehicles: off
- Road vehicles: off
- Ships and ferries: 0
- Leisure boats: 0
- fsx.cfg: TEXTURE_MAX_LOAD=1024
- REX clouds resolution: cumulus 1024, cirrus 512
- FTX Global and FTX Global Vector
- Weather add-on: FS Global Real Weather
As you can see, I'm not that kind of person that is running FSX with very high settings, basically they are anywhere between low and medium.
I did a flight from Orbx/29Palms Southampton and FTX EU England to Thessaloniki with the NGX today. Yesterday from Drzewiecki Designs Warsaw Modlin Airport EPMO. All other sceneries were deactivated, but always the same problem...
Thanks for the report. Agree all looks good, almost the perfect setup. Not sure how consuming are the FTX add-ons but anyway.
That's why you get 2.65GB, which is a normal reading, and is an overall low memory load which should allow you to normally take-off and land too.
I'd only have to resort to hardware (GPU), inability to render textures (black textures) would certainly fit with that.
Not something I saw during testing though but it is possible, because the method we render the city is 'loading up' the graphics card quite a lot, which allows the fast frames.
What's your GPU specs? updated drivers? any external GPU controllers?
I know it's boring, you could perhaps test FSX with a low Global Texture resolution and try the approach. That could 'ease' the GPU load so we can figure out where the problem is coming from.
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LOD_RADIUS=3.500000
OK,if I remember right, this would correspond to 'medium' in FSX, fine.
It's rather odd I have to say. I never exceed 3.2GB VAS (LITE II configuration) with NGX on approach.
Perhaps you could give me base value of VAS when you load the NGX (hope you are using the latest updated version?) at LGTS (LITE II) when sitting at the apron?
If that exceeds the value of 2.7-2.8 GB, then definintely there is a lot going on in the background (other settings too high perhaps, water? AI?)
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Emil,
unfortunately the problem remains, even with your latest City Configurator (LITE II configuration)!
But there's a difference: The OOM warning message doesn't appear, but every time when I'm approaching the city/airport I get this particular warning sound from Windows and the textures of FSX stop loading.
VAS usage is still MUCH higher than with similar add-ons...
Hi,
What's your LOD radius setting?
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Emilios, this implies that I can go from either lite or from lite II to default, correct? The only combination which does NOT work is going from lite II to lite, can you confirm?
That's correct.
Thanks for your report!
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@LCLK: This is normal, your settings are fine. LOD radius can be reduced to medium IF you have VAS issues but leave it as it is otherwise.
Your frames now: This is normal too. Remember, when you are at the airport, FSX renders both the airport and some part the city. Those numbers are by no means a frame 'hit' though.
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We have updated Thessaloniki X City Configurator [v2.0] to reduce scenery complexity and memory usage, for those users who wish to run multiple heavy add-ons in parallel.
For optimised FSX display settings in 'heavy scenarios', please get advice from the product's manual.
The previous 'patching tool' is now obsolete; can be deleted.
Instructions
Please be sure that FSX is shut down before running the configurator.
You will find three options:
-Default Scenery
-LITE Scenery
-LITE II Scenery (for multiple heavy add-ons)
Note that that the installation will work only in 'one direction'.
You can only go:
-From Default downward to LITE
or
-From Default downward to LITE II
or
-From LITE downward to LITE II
If you want to switch versions, but you are not sure which version is currently installed:
-Shut down FSX
-Run the configurator and select Default Scenery to bring back the original files.
-Exit the installer
-Run the configurator again and pick your desired version
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Emilios,
What about making it possible (for those who want) to use the airport only, without the city?
I initially thought it is enough to deactivate the Thessaloniki X_2_Scenery folder.
But I can see some airport bgl's there (ThessalonikiX_airport1, ThessalonikiX_airport2 and ThessalonikiX_airport3), so I am not sure on that. Can you confirm?
I am also not sure on how deactivating the landclass folder (Thessaloniki X_3_LC) could affect the airport itself.
Of course that is no solution for any problem. And cuts off what seems to be a very attractive part of the product.
But it is a temporary suggestion for those simmers who experience some OOM problems and would like to fly to/from the airport in the meantime.
Hi Rafal,
A user can disable Thessaloniki X_2_Scenery and de-activate the city only.
That's definitely not recommended.
Increased RAM is what makes this amount of detail possible. We have tested the RTM default product extensively and no tester ever experienced memory problems. And neither have most users so far. A good example is promotional 'testing' i.e. reviewers&video producers who use heavy add-on aircraft to demonstrate the scenery in full density. None ever reported problems.
I understand that some users simply have:
-numerous VAS consuming add-ons in parallel
-'tweaked' .cfg files- with the exception of the HIGHMEMFIX=1, most other tweaks often cause problems
-very high FSX display settings (e.g. most important is LOD radius; try setting to medium for heavy aircraft approach, same goes for autogen-reduce to Normal or Dense)
All this is well described in our manual with advised settings for each occasion and have been repeatedly tested on long 2-month testing sessions.
That said however, the last patch will have the option to reduce VAS down to very low 'basal' levels. This is really all we can do to accommodate those 'heavier' users, other than that there is nothing else we can do from our side.
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@EmilG yes i use LITE verion . adds on :utx europe ftx flobal and opus weather engine . the other adds on sceneries are disable in scenery library .
thanks for reply
OK, since you are flying on heavy aircraft and use add-ons which also take up significant amount of memory, you can try to follow our FSX diplay settings advice from the manual.
Most important settings:
-Water: Low2.x
-LOD Radius: Medium
-Autogen: Normal
-AI traffic: 30-40%
-Also try to de-activate 3D grass from our scenery manager.
A next patch shall be delivered soon.
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Update - patch installed, flight reloaded, approaching LGTS lite:
Until touchdown VAS increased to 3.6 - 3.7 GB. That's rather "tight"; the patch shouldn't be any "lighter" than it is right now.
Now, what a nice surprise: Aborted the landing and headed straight North over the town (still in my VAS-intensive PMDG T7!). VAS usage went even down(!) to a steady 3.4 GB ... and the town was still looking good:
Christopher, to me it looks like the airport is more VAS-intense than the town.
Emilios, this patch is very enjoyable as an intermediate "one step down" configuration. Maybe an upcoming "switch" could provide an additional option ("two steps down") for those of us who fly heavies and/or with serious weather? I'm thinking of something like:
- LGTS default: for GA planes, for example ("sight-seeing")
- LGTS lite I: current patch/intermediate level (medium-level aircraft, light weather)
- (upcoming) LGTS lite II: for heavies/deep systems and/or with serious weather/multiple cloud layers etc.
Anyhoo, this is an amazing scenery. Will get back to the default installation and do some sight-seeing in a light plane shortly.
This is the results we got here as well. The whole scenery works with levels of detail, the more you leave the 'heavy areas', the less VAS you will have. An even 'lighter' option is a good idea, will provide that lighter patch soon.
@chriskat: I assume you are already using the LITE version? If so, please let us have some FSX display settings, add-ons, etc..etc..please also make sure you keep up to date as we shall be delivering a new patch as well.
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Which area of the town is this? and what are you settings (dispaly) please?i can confirm too it has something in town area.. when i go that way or look my FPS drops 10FPS to 18-20. i dont have problem in other airport i get solid 30FPS at LHS LHBP or LGAV for example.
mainly looking towards the stadium from the airport i get low FPS even with the default aircraft.
Thessaloniki X City Configurator [v3.0] (if you have OOM issues)
in Aerosoft Scenery
Posted
Guys, it has became very apparent that OOM issues, though possible in heavy environments, are not anymore specifically related to LGTS. It has nothing to do with the way we developed it as some people suggested, or anything of that sort. As I will say again, it's a matter of polygons and textures when the user is inside the area of interest. That has been tested extensively and trimmed even further to allow significant amount of free VAS in the latest patches.
Another 'symptom' of bad or 'problematic' development is judged by the footprint that is left after you leave the scenery area. And to that end, our footprint is nill.
Having been following the thread, I see no consistent evidence of anyone (except 2-3 users) having such issues with the scenery. I have reminded myself how to be a FS pilot again, after a loong time, just to test the scenery with ASN, FTXG, and FTXG vector, NGX, REX, UT2, etc..none of those problems ever arose during my own as well as the previous testing pre-release.
Even if one of you has problems, I will pay attention to it, what I m trying to say is that this is not anymore an issue with this particular scenery.
The matter has been beaten to death by now, so is this topic drifting off course. Please open additional threads for the matter of OOMs, as there is nothing else to be 'solved' in LGTS.
Topic closed.