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Fuel Pressure Warning Light


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34 replies to this topic

#1 Coban

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Posted 04 February 2012 - 18:03

Hi, just today I bought Katana 4x. Still trying to learn engine start stuff.

Fuel Shut-off Valve OPEN
Carburetor heat OFF ( pushed in, assuming it is off )
Propeller Lever MAX RPM
Avionics Master Switch OFF
Master Switch Battery/Generator ON
Generator Warning Light illuminated = YES
Fuel Pressure Warning Light illuminated = NO ( but it supposed to be YES according to manual )

Has anyone got an idea why it is not illuminated ? Cheers

Also, I can not remove oil tank cap. Preflight - Oil Liquids, Oil Acces Door or Cowling removed, choose oil to fill, but then I can't see oil tank cap, and refill - drain oil out icons there.
  • 0
Salim Coban
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#2 Piper Pilot

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Posted 04 February 2012 - 18:20

Hi,
does the engine start?

It must be OFF after start. When the engine starts normally and fuel pressure stays within the green marking, you can ignore this.
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Kind Regards,
Patrick


#3 Coban

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Posted 04 February 2012 - 18:35

Hi piper pilot. Yes engine starts, everything works properly. But I don't know why it is not illuminated before engine start. Just wanted to do everything right. by the way, do you know how to turn on Navigation, Radio panel ? Thanks
  • 0
Salim Coban
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#4 EDNR-Cruiser

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Posted 04 February 2012 - 18:43

After switching the battery to "on" you may have to wait a little (depending on air pressure?) before the fuel pressure light illuminates. Did you check if the the fuel pump is switched on?

Concerning the Oil Cap: just clicking on the oil cap to open or close it always worked with my Katana. It's a different story with the oil access door...

Navigation and Radio panel: that is all described in the manual... - please read that first before asking questions here.

BTW: there seems to be a bug in the radio operation if you fly your Katana in "Simple" mode but use the radios in "Realistic" mode. In that combination it seems impossible to change frequencies or switch from standyb to active.
  • 0
Bernd Almstedt
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#5 Coban

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Posted 04 February 2012 - 18:59

After switching the battery to "on" you may have to wait a little (depending on air pressure?) before the fuel pressure light illuminates. Did you check if the the fuel pump is switched on?

Concerning the Oil Cap: just clicking on the oil cap to open or close it always worked with my Katana. It's a different story with the oil access door...

Navigation and Radio panel: that is all described in the manual... - please read that first before asking questions here.

BTW: there seems to be a bug in the radio operation if you fly your Katana in "Simple" mode but use the radios in "Realistic" mode. In that combination it seems impossible to change frequencies or switch from standyb to active.


dude, If I could find the answer in manual, I would not waste time here. I don't know who you are, but do not tell me what to do in that manner, or simply and kindly put a "please" at the end of your sentences.
  • -1
Salim Coban
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#6 Snave

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Posted 04 February 2012 - 19:22

If you have the fuel pump on then pressure rises in the system as soon as the Master switch is on. Thre may also be residual pressure in the system. That is why the operation of the fuel pressure warning light is cautioned as `may take up to ten minutes`.

Basically, if it lights, you are in trouble unless the pump makes it go out.

If it doesn't, you're good to go.And this is correctly explained in the Normal Procedures manual 4.4.3 Starting Engine where it specifically states the light should be `OFF`... not sure where you are reading different?


Can't help on the oil cap - when you have the conditions right left clicking on the oil cap removes it, right click replaces it.

If you can't remove it then either the mouse click function is somehow faulty, or you have not met the conditions required. If the cap is not visible, then please show a screenshot of what you are seeing - seems mighty strange to me that everything else is showing.
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Simon Evans
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#7 EDNR-Cruiser

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Posted 04 February 2012 - 19:30

Hmmmm.... - I see! Apparently you've got some problems with reading! :rolleyes:

It doesn't matter anyhow but if you would direct your eyes to your quote, I seem to have written "please read that first..."

Concerning avionics: Manual 7, page 20 and Manual 1, page 31 plus the normal procedures checklist in Manual 4 should provide you with enough information.

BTW: on page 10 of Manual 4 you will also find a special note regarding the fuel pressure light.
  • 0
Bernd Almstedt
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#8 Snave

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Posted 04 February 2012 - 19:34

Rushing through the manuals is not advised.

Rushing to judgement on those that assist you is most assuredly counter-productive.

Slow down, take your time and learn. This GA is at least as complex as the Airbus X. Yes, really.
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Simon Evans
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#9 Coban

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Posted 04 February 2012 - 19:40

Thanks guys, Fuel pump should be caused because of residual pressure as you explained. For avionics, I better check those pages in manual. By the way, sorry Bernd Almstedt, you right I did not see it. :(

Oil cap, I will put a screenie.
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Salim Coban
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#10 EDNR-Cruiser

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Posted 04 February 2012 - 19:41

One more hint free of charge: :rolleyes:

Once you listen to Snave's excellent advice and slow down and take your time and watch the panel and the instruments, you will notice some more on/off switches which can and should be operated... B) :D

Regards,

The "Dude"... B)
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Bernd Almstedt
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#11 Coban

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Posted 04 February 2012 - 21:45

Posted Image


As you see, there is no icons for the cap and refill, drain out.

Posted Image

Here, there is two blue things on left wing. Any idea what they are ? :)

Lastly, I am wondering, where is the aileron and rudder trims. Seriously I checked all manuals, but couldn't find anything about them. Also, since I installed Katana, I am not able to load it cold and dark. I do select Cold and dark option, in settings within the FSX session, but on next load, it will be engine running state. Ahh, one more thing, only few times, I saw menu on left side, with a header 4X, and there was some options below that, like cold and dark, take off state. I was never able to use it, as it just goes away, in a few seconds. I don't know how to bring it back. Worst is, now I don't see that menu at all. I was seeing it, at the beginning of FSX session, now it never shows up. But I still see 4X header left side, it will stay there unless I left mouse click on it.
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Salim Coban
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#12 Coban

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Posted 04 February 2012 - 21:49



in this video at 0.51, it shows how to open the oil cap. In my case, I never see that blue oil cap icon to click.
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Salim Coban
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#13 EDNR-Cruiser

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Posted 04 February 2012 - 21:51

Looks like you forgot to put the caps back in place before your first flight... - and now they're gone.
I would simply reset the plane if I were you and start anew.

Another way would be to go to the "Maintenance" section and replace them there... - but again! Take your time! The Katana is a pretty normal plane for a real world pilot but quite complex for someone without the proper practice and training.

Concerning trim tabs: there is a huge, fat, big symbol in your picture named "Trim Tabs"... - might by a mighty clever idea to try this out, right?!
  • 0
Bernd Almstedt
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#14 Snave

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Posted 04 February 2012 - 21:53

Oil cap is second item from left, below the dipstick in the Oil and Liquids selection in your picture.

You can't dip the dipstick until you've removed the oil cap - and you can't get a proper reading without first turning the prop - under the oil access door. And nothing works if you don't put the cap back on before flying!

Hope this helps, and it's all in the manual!
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Simon Evans
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#15 EDNR-Cruiser

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Posted 04 February 2012 - 22:00

Snave

Apologies but as you can see in his picture the caps are gone! Just at it happens if you forget to put them back in place after a first check and no, if you don't turn the propeller you will not get a correct reading of the oil status. It will then always show the oil level as too low! You need to turn the propeller first to get the oil from the crankshaft back into the reservoir.

...and yes, it's all in the manual! :rolleyes: :)
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Bernd Almstedt
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#16 Coban

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Posted 04 February 2012 - 22:02

okay I will reset the plane, and report back. For the trims, I mean where they are inside cockpit ?


btw, any comment for second picture, and dark and cold start ?
  • 0
Salim Coban
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#17 EDNR-Cruiser

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Posted 04 February 2012 - 22:13

There is only an elevator trim inside the cockpit... - as explained in the manuals.
The small trim tabs at the ailerons can only be bend when on the ground to adjust the level flight behaviour. This however is something for the experienced and very patient pilot as it requires hours of very constant flying and trying... - took me about three hours and 10 take-offs to get it right in the end and even now it only works at a specific combination of speed, altitude, RPM and manifold pressure - just like in real life...

The "cold and dark start" sequence probably depends on how you begin your flight. In your case I would not load a saved flight but start from scratch: select you plane, your airport, your weather, season and time and off you go... I can see it every time I load my Katana for about 4-5 seconds, that's what you get, no more. You can also pick your preferences in the "Settings" menu by the way...
  • 0
Bernd Almstedt
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#18 Coban

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Posted 04 February 2012 - 22:24

Thanks Bernd. Its gonna be little bit painful without flying aileron trim despite, using zero p-factor, and auto rudder. I actually will not be doing trial and error for trims. So, probably I will be switching autopilot asap. Hmm, by the way, hope there is an autopilot, did not check it yet though.

Resetting data didn't do the trick. I guess something wrong with my install, so will try to reinstall. I'll report back. Cheers.
  • 0
Salim Coban
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#19 EDNR-Cruiser

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Posted 04 February 2012 - 22:31

Bad luck, Aslan.The Katana is a rather "manual" bird to fly and though it has a GPS there is neither an autopilot nor good old fashioned DME or ADF on board.

No problem to leave the Katana "as is" on short hops but if you want to enjoy longer trips you should look into the trim tab setting... - as any real world pilot would do. Otherwise flights of 2 hours and more may become annoying.
Even though I fly with winds, gusts and turbulences turned on I can now easily leave my Katana alone for a minute or two once it's configured for level and cruise flight.
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Bernd Almstedt
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#20 Coban

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Posted 04 February 2012 - 22:56

oh my god, even there is no DME ? lol I would not buy if I would know these. Nevermind, at least it will be good for practice. Bernd, I flown with ZERO wind, but it still drift to left. No P-Factor, and auto rudder is on. Why would it drift to left without even p-factor and on zero wind ? So I guess, I really need aileron trim before take off. Can you post a screenshot how much you bending trim ? I guess you only bending right aileron, right ?

reinstall did not help for the oil cap issue. and I guess I have some more issues with menu. I am downloading again, perhaps something was wrong with download, will report back. Cheers


EDIT : So frustrating. Even re-download and install according to manual, I have same issues. I better open a ticket.
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Salim Coban
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#21 Snave

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Posted 04 February 2012 - 23:34

Again you are asking questions which have long been discovered and answered - the exaggerated effect of off-centre mass in FSX is well-known and equally well-documented. Not an issue for this bird in isolation.

It has nothing to do with p-factor (of which there is little in a Rotax engined GA anyway) nor can it be compensated for by auto-rudder - it is simply a function of the effect of off-centreline mass such as pilot, passenger and fuel. There is no offset fuel effect in this aircraft as the fuel is on the centreline anyway, so to lesson the effect you simply match the weight on the seats. And then spend some time with the manually-adjustable trim tabs as you would in a real aircraft.

There are already topics about adding the autopilot to the aircraft .cfg. The Rotax-engined Katana is not equipped with an autopilot, but can be effectively trimmed out to fly straight and true without. Same is true of the Katana 4X, but you can always modify the aircraft.cfg for an unreal representation...

DME is present, as a function of programming the GPS...
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Simon Evans
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#22 Coban

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Posted 05 February 2012 - 00:12

Thanks Snave for help. But I never fly with GPS, I simply hate GPS :) DME is not a must though, but it would be nice if a new model aircraft like Katana would have one. For the exaggerated effect of off-centre mass in FSX, I do have Carenado c185, and airbus X, and never had this left drifting effect while flying with them. As there is no rudder and aileron trim in cockpit, only option left is bending trims on the ground and it is gonna be hard to find right configuration for the different weather. I guess I will just grab my joystick and never let it go till landing.
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Salim Coban
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#23 Snave

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Posted 05 February 2012 - 00:23

GPS is the de facto standard in aircraft navigation in 2012. As a multi-function instrument it has effectively replaced half a dozen different pieces of equipment. It's there to be used, not `hated`.

As for the drift tendencies - I hardly think comparing a high-wing, six-seat taildragger which weighs as much empty as this two-seat tricycle low-wing composite does at gross is even worth comparison. And no way can you look to an Airbus for ANY correlation whatosever! You may as well compare an Aardvark with an Ark.

But in either case if you took the proportional weight and added it equivalent off-centreline, I can assure you the result would be exactly the same...
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Simon Evans
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#24 Coban

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Posted 05 February 2012 - 00:34

lol, okay I don't hate it. But it looks so ugly, the textures of GPS, I mean it just ruining all awesomeness in the cockpit. What about Reality XP, it gives better textures I guess. Do you recommend it ? Also, can I use VOR with GPS ? Not looking for a detailed explain, just if it is possible or not. Because I don't wanna fly direct from one point to other. I want to use VORs, waypoints, stuff like that. For the weight, I can try to load copilot to balance weight. Thanks for your time Snave.


EDIT : I can't see coolant cap as well, so there is no oil cap and coolant cap. Dowload three times, and reinstalled three times. Still I've got the issue, really so annoying, why this happening to me, only to me. I opened a ticket, but hope someone here have an idea..it would be quicker than email support. cheers

EDIT 2 : I can't believe this the product, people keep saying MORE COMPLEX GA PLANE. This is most bugged GA PLANE. How to turn on radio ??? spending 10 minutes to turn thing on, why simply no mouse wheel option for that ? left click mouse and try to turn it on, it is almost impossible. Not finished, got mad trying to turn on a button, then it doesn't work AT ALL !!! Seriously can I just get a refund ? this isn't fair, ruining all my day, selling a buggy addon. not fair.

EDIT 3 : Now there is towbar on fresh session. I can't disable towbar, towbar simply there for no reason, and will not go away. I can not add co pilot. I click maintenance and it will tie down plane.
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Salim Coban
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#25 EDNR-Cruiser

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Posted 05 February 2012 - 08:27

It is always easier to blame the developer than looking for ones own mistakes... - but it doesn't improve the situation much!

All I can say is that the Katana works fine on dozens of systems - from x year old steam machines as mine to some super high tech 64bit systems that some users are running here. Sure, there are still some hickups with the Katana V1.03a but no big bugs left - at least not to my knowledge. Whenever someone reported problems like you have, it was always a problem with the installation procedure.

You don't need to download your version more than once as long as you don't get an error message during installation that the archive is corrupted. However a proper installation with Win7 as OS is not so trivial. Did you make sure to install the Katana as Administrator (not just with administration rights) and did you turn off your antivirus prior installation? I don't remember if you have to activate the Katana with the Aerosoft launcher but you should look into this, too.

What do you mean with "can I use VOR with GPS"? You can not switch the GPS signal as source for the CDI, if that is your question.

Turning on the radios is EXACTLY like in the real plane and not buggy at all!
First you switch on the Avionics Master next to the generator switch and then the individual devices via their on/off dials (located at the lower left corner of each device - just as in real life). If your display is too small or the resolution too low you can easily zoom in to get a better "feel" for the knobs.

It is correct that you can not add a co-pilot, you can only add the weight of a co-pilot to balance the aircraft (if you want). The co-pilot will not show up in the cockpit however... - would be a nice feature though. B) Based on the entered weight Marcel could show a fat old fellow, a sexy lady or a kid as co-pilot... Otherwise some users might complain that the co-pilot looks unrealistic for 35kg weight... :rolleyes:

The Katana 4x IS a very complex GA model - you can't expect results as quickly as with a stock FSX Cessna. Read the manual thoroughly and then read it again. Take your time to go through all the different menus (Settings, Maintenance, Service, etc.).

Consider this plane as if you required a "type rating" for it. In real life you have to learn and train, too, to get a type rating awarded.

If you don't want to invest that much time there is still the option to enjoy the Katana 4x in the "Simple" mode - which actually isn't that simple! You will still have to obey the limits to avoid wear, malfunctions, damage or even a crash but every time you load the Katana, you will sit in a brand new one - no need to deal with oil changes, tire checks, cleaning and so on.

Concerning the towbar: I had this problem three times in more than 100 flights and reported this to Marcel already (towbar shown and no wheel fairings for the main gear). I could always solve it by cancelling that flight and reloading it. I have no idea what causes this problem, maybe some data from the saved flight.
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Bernd Almstedt
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#26 Snave

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Posted 05 February 2012 - 09:12

Coban, thanks for filling in your profile it sure makes it easier for us to know who we're dealing with!

There are two separate options for displaying VOR data. Not only that `hated` GPS, which can also feed the VOR gauge (and which can be swapped out for the Realty XP) but also the KX125 combined Comm/Nav unit. Manual 9 starting at 9.1 gives all the details - how to display BRG, RAD or CFI information on the unit as well as the guage.


Turning on the radio is, as Bernd says, exactly as in the real deal, which I fly. and yes it is a little fiddly in real life, especially if you have gloves on..! So forgive me if tell you that what you are seeing is `realSIM` and `realISM` working in perfect harmony!
Surely if you have experience with the Airbus you are more than familiar with that concept!! :glare_s:


As it is, the on-off function is something you only use once per flight normally, so it's performed as a mouse drag, whereas `ident` is something you might want several times in every flight, so take the simpler left:right mouse click option - again the Avionics manual has full details.
It's the perennial problem of multi-function buttons but FSUIPC can be used to provide key commands, as indeed can the basic FSX control options.
.
As for the towbar, this is a sign that either the saved flight has become confused, or that the last session was not ended correctly, Again the manual has details on the Initiation Window which provides menu options for configuring the Katana at the start of each session. Use it, then save that flight and that should ensure you can launch the next time without the confusion.

But with all these things `missing` I am siding with Bernd that what you have is a faulty installation, brought about by the OS, and nothing to do with a buggy addon.

Have you disabled UAC? Installed FSX on its own dedicated partition? Was the Katana X installed in Safe Mode, or with Administration privileges?
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Simon Evans
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#27 Coban

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Posted 05 February 2012 - 12:19

Guys, I've got a FSX dedicated pc, no virus no malware and updated fully. As Bernd mentioned, I do not receive any error during the dowload, and anti virus program AVG 2012 free edition disabled (by unchecking resident shield option) during the dowloand and install. I never use windows security softwares, including firewall. UAC disabled, and FSX folder is in C: so address is C:/FSX. I do right click on exe and choose run as administrator to install. I do activate it during install, I have launcher installed, but never use it. I will delete it this time, perhabs it is the cause. Before unistall I first reset data, then restart PC, using advanced system care pro, clean all registry and stuff before fresh install. But the thing is, I installed FSX from deluxe CD with SP1 and SP2, I have accelerator CD, but did not want to install it, as it would take more space. So I download service packs separately. But only this addon I have issues, so I don't think FSX setup is causing it. Okay I guess I can assign a key for radio button through FSUIPC, but radio does not work at all. I checked forums, and saw a post by Bernd, saying Radio may malfunction if addon is in Simple state. I will make a proper uninstall again, and a very carefull install, then will choose only Realistic option, let see if things get solved. I will report back. Cheers
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Salim Coban
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#28 Coban

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Posted 05 February 2012 - 14:37

Bernd and Simon, thanks a lot, and sorry for all rambling you heard from me. Apparently, I fixed many issues, the solution came with choosing Realistic mode. Now, things work as like they supposed to. You may think, why I would choose Simple mode, and try to maintenance aircraft in first place, because I just wanted to learn how things work first, then wanted to use Realistic mode. But, in Simple mode, Radio will not work, and you can't learn maintenance settings because they will not work properly. Nevermind, I already learnt lots of stuff, now flying in Realistic mode, and love the aircraft.

As sorted abnormal behaviours of the addon, I would like to ask few more question related to system depth. Hope you will keep helping me.

First, what is the Emergency Locator Transmitter, and how to use it ? Manual 4 page 5, refer this, but I couldn't understand it.

Second, on walkaround, I see Stall warning and Pitot Static Probe needs attention, but I couldn't find a way to inspect, or maintenance them.\

Also, wondering something about addon data. First I start a session with ultra light, and turn all switches off, then choose Katana, it was cold and dark. In settings I chose Dark and Cold initiate option. I saved that flight. Now, I can load that flight, and it is in cold and dark state, but what I am wondering is, in realistic mode, do I need to park somewhere before quiting flight ? Becuase sometimes I just land and quit FS. In this case, how this wearing and damaging affects going on ? Thanks

Edit : I still really having hard times to turn the radio on. In FSUIPC, I could not find a command to turn radio on ( the command list came with Katana included ). Have you got any idea how to assign it in FSUIPC ? or should I ask this in FSUIPC forums ? by the way, I've got registered version of FSUIPC.
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Salim Coban
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#29 EDNR-Cruiser

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Posted 05 February 2012 - 14:53

I guess the checklist is taken from a real Katana - you don't have to deal with the ELT in this simulation, there will be no rescue team charging you if you crash... ;)

All you need to do is click on the stall warning and Pitot probe... - if you like the sound you can keep the mouse button pressed on the stall warning to enjoy the sound of the horn...

I'm not sure if you need to park your Katana before quitting the FS. I sometimes also just quit after taxiing from the runway - without any penalty yet (clocked about 100 hrs Hobbs time). If you park before quitting please make sure to switch the Avionics Master to Off before shutting down the engine!
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#30 Snave

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Posted 05 February 2012 - 15:06

In the walkround one normally checks that the stall warning in the leading edge is free and loose with a finger or pen, and that the pitot tube is free of ice, insects and grime - you can do this with a little suck if you love your airplane that much (but ALWAYS only when no-one is watching...)

Posted Image

As even this depth of simulation has yet to come up with a SimSuck addon (my God, it's the ultimate - Aerosoft? Get right on it!), the solution here is simply to click a mouseclick on them when doing the walkround - the stall will actually sound off as Bernd notes if you suck on it long enough!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rij0vpw_HSc
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Simon Evans
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#31 Coban

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Posted 05 February 2012 - 15:38

LoL thanks for the info. By the way, SimSuck addon is a very good idea :)

Last question guys, when do you retract flaps after take off ? In my experience, after take off, reached 600ft, reduce Prop RPM to 2200, but then speed goes down to 50. But I guess I need something around 60 with T/O flaps. I can just retreat flaps and reach 65knt, but manual says you retreat flaps when reach cruise altitude.
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Salim Coban
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#32 Piper Pilot

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Posted 05 February 2012 - 16:26

Hi,
I always retract flaps at Vy and about 500 feet AGL in real life. In sim you can of course retract them earlier. Important is that you have enough speed and obstacle ahead.
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Kind Regards,
Patrick


#33 Coban

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Posted 05 February 2012 - 16:30

thanks for the info.
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Salim Coban
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#34 Snave

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Posted 05 February 2012 - 17:39

The 100-horse Rotax is only approved for 5-mins max at t/o (full) power, but max continuous is actually only few hp shy of max, at about 95hp.

Because of this, and mindful of the relatively low Vfe of 81 knots, I normally do the after take-off power and prop reduction to 2,400rpm (2,200 is too low, that's more a low cruise setting), reduce climb angle until 70 kts at 1,000 AGL, then retract flaps. As Piper Pilot mentions, using 500 ft AGL to commence this is pretty consistent.

Generally in lower density altitudes it isn't necessary to use the full five minutes, and the flaps are there more to reduce the airspeed of the very clean airframe in approach and landing rather than provide increase in lift at take-off, so think of flaps as a tool for Vx rather than Vy. Unless you need the down-range obstacle clearance, you reduce power and prop then lower the nose to gain the speed immediately, and retract flaps before Vfe.,.

If you think of it on a time schedule, with an initial `dirty` climb out of about 700 ft/min full power, five minutes would get you to 3,500 feet even without flap retraction. The problem with doing it the other way round (flaps first, then power) is that full power and the clean airframe can lead to a near-miss with Vfe unless you keep a close eye on the IAS, pr raise the nose - and that's the last thing you want to be doing when you should be `eyes out` on initial climb..!
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Simon Evans
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#35 Coban

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Posted 05 February 2012 - 19:27

The 100-horse Rotax is only approved for 5-mins max at t/o (full) power, but max continuous is actually only few hp shy of max, at about 95hp.

Because of this, and mindful of the relatively low Vfe of 81 knots, I normally do the after take-off power and prop reduction to 2,400rpm (2,200 is too low, that's more a low cruise setting), reduce climb angle until 70 kts at 1,000 AGL, then retract flaps. As Piper Pilot mentions, using 500 ft AGL to commence this is pretty consistent.

Generally in lower density altitudes it isn't necessary to use the full five minutes, and the flaps are there more to reduce the airspeed of the very clean airframe in approach and landing rather than provide increase in lift at take-off, so think of flaps as a tool for Vx rather than Vy. Unless you need the down-range obstacle clearance, you reduce power and prop then lower the nose to gain the speed immediately, and retract flaps before Vfe.,.

If you think of it on a time schedule, with an initial `dirty` climb out of about 700 ft/min full power, five minutes would get you to 3,500 feet even without flap retraction. The problem with doing it the other way round (flaps first, then power) is that full power and the clean airframe can lead to a near-miss with Vfe unless you keep a close eye on the IAS, pr raise the nose - and that's the last thing you want to be doing when you should be `eyes out` on initial climb..!


Thanks a lot Snave. Very helpful and well explained.
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Salim Coban
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