A340-4

318/19 Crazy descend rates

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Hey Mathijs ,

 

I must to tell you that I have problems with descend / climb rates on each flight.

Today I tried to slow down and I was behind the curve all the time just as you said.

The speedbrakes couldn't help cause extending them increased rate of descend to high numbers.

 

 

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But there has to be a local (or pilot) element as there are dozens of video's now that show fine approaches. And while we agree we got issues there the testers simply do not into these issues like you do. As I written,. there are MANY places on the internet where speed management for the busses is discussed and we found a lot applies pretty well. Slow down first, nose down second.

 

Again, we know it's an issue we have to explore more but if you have issues on every climb and every descend there might very well be something else going on.

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Hello everyone,

 

as promised, here's some info about a test flight where I experienced this too.

 

Yesterday I flew from SKBQ to SKCL using the A318.

DEP RWY: 05

SID: BAQ1F

 

LDG RWY: 02

STAR: ESAR1A

 

ROUTE: CTG UG438 ULQ

 

I flew on FL350 and initiated the descent profile down to FL50 at the TOD point.

And the result was quiet the same as on basically any other flight I did so far. Up until the point where I reached about FL80 he aircraft descended with a rate of about -4500 to -6000 fpm, even with the help of the speedbrakes.

 

For this test scenario I did NOT use Active Sky, only the "Fair weather" preset.

FPS where steady and the lowest value I've seen was 43 fps.

 

If you need more Info, just let me know.

 

BR

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I can add a few data as well:

 

LIPZ - LIRN

CHI7V CHI L612 ANC M736 TEA TEA1C

ZFW 54.1

Fuel 7.9

No active sky, weather setting "clear skies"

I initiated the descent 10nm before the TOD. Ended up descending 6800 ft/minute again.

 

2018-8-8_18-53-43-26.thumb.jpg.3e60f777f2bad353deb5dce161cabbe5.jpg

2018-8-8_18-53-45-658.thumb.jpg.5d0b236c9184026b94f60fb1227c74db.jpg2018-8-8_19-8-51-699.thumb.jpg.88c8f6d9e055f08f2846889aba46090b.jpg2018-8-8_19-34-56-949.thumb.jpg.38f4454cbc08cf1e49b8df67a91d5812.jpg2018-8-8_19-37-29-394.thumb.jpg.7986183d90cb360156a180d82b83701f.jpg

 

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On 8/7/2018 at 11:07 AM, 19_Invictus_21 said:

s some info ab

I too would like to know, 

Thanks, 

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Hello,

I decided to try your flight today using Ver 1100 A319 with the loadsheet similar to yours.

My system is an older one i7-2600k 32GB 4.0GHzOC with a EVGA 970GTX

P3Dv4.3 is a full install and there is little extra scenery.

I use ORBX Global and NA/SA/EU Landclass.

FPS were around 50 most of the time.

 

[CoRte]
ArptDep=LIPZ
ArptArr=LIRN
RwyDep=LIPZ04R
RwyArr=LIRN4.Z
RwyArrFINAL=ILS24.Z
SID=CHI7V
STAR=TEA1C
APPR_Trans=POM1
Airway1=L612
Airway1FROM=CHI
Airway1TO=ANC
Airway2=M736
Airway2FROM=ANC
Airway2TO=TEA

 

Altitude was set to FL340 cruise.

I used the full copilot checklist with 250 speed control turned on.

After Descent checklist I set the final altitude to 2000.

15nm before TOD I engaged descent.

Initial descent was 1000 fpm for some time after which it did its normal thing and started to descend more rapidly.

I watched the descent rate and speed. The descent was about 2800 fpm @ 310knots for most of the descent

At 12000 I engaged speed brakes to get the thing under better speed control.

I left them on until the thrusters started to climb after which the speed brakes were off.

The rest of the approach and landing were full auto with nothing strange happening.

 

 

 

 

a319fps.jpg

a319app.jpg

lipz-lifn-loadsheet.JPG

a319descent.jpg

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2 minutes ago, canuck21a said:

Hello,

I decided to try your flight today using Ver 1100 A319 with the loadsheet similar to yours.

My system is an older one i7-2600k 32GB 4.0GHzOC with a EVGA 970GTX

P3Dv4.3 is a full install and there is little extra scenery.

I use ORBX Global and NA/SA/EU Landclass.

FPS were around 50 most of the time.

 

[CoRte]
ArptDep=LIPZ
ArptArr=LIRN
RwyDep=LIPZ04R
RwyArr=LIRN4.Z
RwyArrFINAL=ILS24.Z
SID=CHI7V
STAR=TEA1C
APPR_Trans=POM1
Airway1=L612
Airway1FROM=CHI
Airway1TO=ANC
Airway2=M736
Airway2FROM=ANC
Airway2TO=TEA

 

Altitude was set to FL340 cruise.

I used the full copilot checklist with 250 speed control turned on.

After Descent checklist I set the final altitude to 2000.

15nm before TOD I engaged descent.

Initial descent was 1000 fpm for some time after which it did its normal thing and started to descend more rapidly.

I watched the descent rate and speed. The descent was about 2800 fpm @ 310knots for most of the descent

At 12000 I engaged speed brakes to get the thing under better speed control.

I left them on until the thrusters started to climb after which the speed brakes were off.

The rest of the approach and landing were full auto with nothing strange happening.

 

 

 

Other than your speed being a little fast, that sounds like a normal descent to me.

 

Thanks!

 

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Indeed all pretty normal.

 

As I written before we can only recreate these issues internally when we deliberately cause issues like for example not managing speed correctly. More and more we feel this issue could be related to other strange unexpected behavior we seen that is now sure to be caused by sims that were update by just the client update. 

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For my part: 

I've been flying the aerosoft busses since the very first Version and haven't had any issue like this ever. I haven't changed my Speed Management behavior as well. I've tried the same Route with the other bus and it Worked quite well. It seemed to me, it calculated the TOD earlier then the aerosoft Bus. That looks like some Kind of reason to me. 

I also Never only Update the client only. 

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1 hour ago, Mathijs Kok said:

Indeed all pretty normal.

 

As I written before we can only recreate these issues internally when we deliberately cause issues like for example not managing speed correctly. More and more we feel this issue could be related to other strange unexpected behavior we seen that is now sure to be caused by sims that were update by just the client update. 

Mathijs,

 

I am having issues on full fresh install of p3d v4.3 (not just client update)...

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Okay, we are having a event at our offices this Saturday and one customer told me he had the issue and could show it to me on his laptop. Indeed it showed weird behavior. As he did the client update we are now removing then sim and reinstalling it (we got it on our network so no long download). It will be the first time I can see if the aircraft behaves different. 

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4 hours ago, Mathijs Kok said:

Indeed all pretty normal.

 

As I written before we can only recreate these issues internally when we deliberately cause issues like for example not managing speed correctly. More and more we feel this issue could be related to other strange unexpected behavior we seen that is now sure to be caused by sims that were update by just the client update. 

I updated the whole version, not only the client 

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Have you followed the instructions in the Lockheed Martin Update Guide, which is linked on the P3D download page, when updating your sim? 

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1 minute ago, Tom A320 said:

Have you followed the instructions in the Lockheed Martin Update Guide, which is linked on the P3D download page, when updating your sim? 

Hi Tom;

Yes, of course.

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We saw many cases here where people didn't followed the instructions in that guide and ended up in a corrupted P3D installation. That's why I asked. 

 

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2 hours ago, Mathijs Kok said:

Okay, we are having a event at our offices this Saturday and one customer told me he had the issue and could show it to me on his laptop. Indeed it showed weird behavior. As he did the client update we are now removing then sim and reinstalling it (we got it on our network so no long download). It will be the first time I can see if the aircraft behaves different. 

Hi;

Were you able to replicate the issue? 
Thanks, 

 

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I did a flight last night and deliberately tried to get the aircraft to do this... and despite my efforts it was a normal flight (except for other known issues).

 

Here's an idea... can you try flying with a CI of 50 and see if that improves the descent rate for you?

 

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Vor 1 Stunde, DaveCT2003 sagte:

I did a flight last night and deliberately tried to get the aircraft to do this... and despite my efforts it was a normal flight (except for other known issues).

 

Here's an idea... can you try flying with a CI of 50 and see if that improves the descent rate for you?

 

Hi Dave. I did as you suggested. Here are the results:

Weather theme "clear skies", 25-40 fps the entire flight.

 

Flight EWG9067 

EDDN - EDDL

SULU3K SULUS L604 MASEK Z52 ARPEG Z850 ADEMI T854 DOMUX DOMU2G

ZFW 56.1

Fuel 5.5

 

2018-8-11_20-12-36-268.thumb.jpg.c6b1f27dc6ddf80ae7ae171e30911e34.jpg

I changed the Cruise level to 340 during the flight, so the descent phase would be longer and as the Bus climbed to 250 like a rocket in 9 minutes.

 

 

2018-8-11_20-12-37-934.thumb.jpg.91b955a5cf498033389d9901a776fe25.jpg

 

I initiated the descent about 10nm before I reached the TOD.

2018-8-11_20-40-50-964.thumb.jpg.94133e2b7cbd61b20ea3e8a0b647c0a2.jpg

 

And here we go. Shortly after, the descent path raced from top to bottom and the bus began its dive:

2018-8-11_20-41-27-978.thumb.jpg.d6a2b3c70bd4d3327caf537ee2732e69.jpg

 

Some time later it caught the descent path again and managed to follow it, but still with a rate of 3500 feet.

2018-8-11_20-43-39-145.thumb.jpg.61febafeb49a89435bf9bec359583783.jpg

 

Hope, it helps!

 

Best wishes!

Tom

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22 minutes ago, Rappi said:

Hi Dave. I did as you suggested. Here are the results:

 

I don't mind telling you that this one is really throwing us for a loop, especially given that we're not able to replicate it.

 

Are you checking to verify that all the waypoint and STAR crossing restrictions on the chart are correct in the FMGS?  I ask, because maybe they are not correct and the FMGS is diving like mad to reach one that is there?

 

 

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Thanks Tom,

I hope aerosoft team going to help us to find what is wrong or to solve this issue.

I find this issue disrups flight experience.

Gregory

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5 minutes ago, DaveCT2003 said:

 

I don't mind telling you that this one is really throwing us for a loop, especially given that we're not able to replicate it.

 

Are you checking to verify that all the waypoint and STAR crossing restrictions on the chart are correct in the FMGS?  I ask, because maybe they are not correct and the FMGS is diving like mad to reach one that is there?

 

 

Hi Dave. The same happens to me.

On the last flight I checked all restrictions in the FMGS.

I tried CI 50, 25 and 15.

Gregory

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1 hour ago, Rappi said:

SULU3K SULUS L604 MASEK Z52 ARPEG Z850 ADEMI T854 DOMUX DOMU2G

 

 

I did notice that this is a VERY short route.  Do you have the same experience with say a 2 hour flight?  Also, with such a short route I'd really like you to take a look to see if the SID and STAR crossing restrictions are programmed into the FMGS and that no short cuts are being taken.

 

What was your cruise altitude for that flight?

 

 

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