OOMs, VAS usage & Frame rates

[FlyingAce63 1]

Correct me if I'm wrong but I was under the impression (from what I've read online) that SIMstarter was developed mainly to help with low frame rate  and OOM issues. Was I wrong? I mean isn't the point of creating new config sets for achieving better frame rates and no OOMs? It seems that no matter what I do, I can't avoid these two problems. I even created a "route scenery" set where I only choose the base scenery needed, FTX, Vector, and the departure and destination airports scenery. I uncheck everything else and still I get low frame rates and OOMs in the PMDG 737 NGX in P3D v3, especially at CYYZ using FlyTampa scenery. I can't even make it to the runway at CYYZ without an OOM crash. By the time the sim loads with PMDG and CYYZ scenery, I'm left with slightly higher than half of 1 gig in remaining VAS. And If I was flying to CYYZ, I never make it past the STAR. The FSUIPC VAS warning begins to beep near the Top of Descent and finally crashes half way through the STAR. Can anyone tell me if I'm wrong for expecting SIMstarter to help with these issues?

 

Here are my specs....

 

• i7 4770K at 3.5Ghz
• 16GB of ram
• GTX 1070 OC with 8GB ram
• Samsung 850 pro SSD
• P3D v3 (latest update)
• Orbx Global, Vector, NA openLC, PNW region, FTX Trees HD, NA & EU freeware packs
• ASN
• TrackIR
• EZdok

[Tom A320 4915]

Of course SIMstarter helps with memory usage.

 

But if your base set of scenery you are using plus the aircraft consumes already so much memory as you have described then there is nothing SIMstarter can do for you. It just makes sure that things you are not using are definitely out from your memory.

 

Keep in mind that FTX Global, Vector and openLC do not come for nothing in terms of memory usage. For a quick check try a config set that has all Orbx stuff disabled. That will give you an impression of how much memory it alone consumes and what it leaves for your two airports and the aircraft.

 

ASN of course also uses memory. Disable it as well for a test to see how much.

 

[FlyingAce63 1]

39 minutes ago, Tom A320 said:

Of course SIMstarter helps with memory usage.

 

But if your base set of scenery you are using plus the aircraft consumes already so much memory as you have described then there is nothing SIMstarter can do for you. It just makes sure that things you are not using are definitely out from your memory.

 

Keep in mind that FTX Global, Vector and openLC do not come for nothing in terms of memory usage. For a quick check try a config set that has all Orbx stuff disabled. That will give you an impression of how much memory it alone consumes and what it leaves for your two airports and the aircraft.

 

ASN of course also uses memory. Disable it as well for a test to see how much.

 

 

I'm sorry Tom but that makes no sense to me. If SIMstarter can't do anything with simply the "required" base scenery plus the Orbx stuff plus the aircraft and only the two airports needed for the flight, then what's the point of having SIMstarter? When can it do something? When you have only the default scenery, default aircraft and no Orbx? Why would you even need it under those conditions? You wouldn't be experiencing low frame rates or OOMs with the default setup. I thought by deactivating all the other sceneries not needed for a given flight would help. My understanding is that when the complete scenery library is loaded, it taxes your system even though you're not flying near those areas.

[Tom A320 4915]

Instead of arguing I would suggest you simply do the test I suggested to get an idea of what your "base scenery" (base + Orbx + ASN) is already consuming.

 

P3Dv3 comes with a very good memory management. Much better than P3Dv2 and beyond comparison to FSX. Admittedly SIMstarter is of much greater help with FSX than it is with P3D.

 

But as I said, do the simple test, disable all your "base stuff" (Orbx and ASN) and see what the difference is.

[FlyingAce63 1]

1 minute ago, Tom A320 said:

Instead of arguing I would suggest you simply do the test I suggested to get an idea of what your "base scenery" (base + Orbx + ASN) is already consuming.

 

P3Dv3 comes with a very good memory management. Much better than P3Dv2 and beyond comparison to FSX. Admittedly SIMstarter is of much greater help with FSX than it is with P3D.

 

But as I said, do the simple test, disable all your "base stuff" (Orbx and ASN) and see what the difference is.

 

Fair enough.

[Tom A320 4915]

And of course you shouldn't limit SIMstarter to a VAS management tool. It is soooooo much more.

[FlyingAce63 1]

Ok Tom, here are the results of the test....

• With base scenery
• Orbx Global, Vector and openLC
• FlyTampa CYUL and CYYZ activated
• PMDG 737
• ASN
• FSDreamteam GSX
• REX 4 Texture Direct & Soft Clouds (with clouds, runways and taxiways resolution set to 1024)

The remaining VAS was 1041148.

Then, with Vectors deactivated, it was 1507120. So, Vector used up roughly 466 MB.

Then, with Orbx Global and openLC deactivated, it was 1563400. So, Orbx used up roughly 56 MB.

Then, with ASN deactivated, it was 1556244. Basically no effect because ASN has more of an effect on frame rate than VAS.

Then, with the default Baron instead of the NGX, it was 2064928. So, the NGX used up roughly 509 MB or half of a GB.

Finally, with lower display settings, it was 2289912. A slight increase of roughly 225 MB

 

Ok, now I've done what you suggested yet I still don't understand the point of this test. All it's telling us is that Vector and the NGX are eating up a big chunk (~ 1GB) of the VAS memory, which is really nothing new. We already know this. What I'd like to know is how is SIMstarter helping with OOMs if it can't do a thing about this common setup. In other words, what's the point of having SIMstarter if there is nothing it can do to prevent OOMs with a highly common setup as mine? I'm not trying to be argumentative nor condescending. Claims have been made that it helps with frame rate and OOMs, yet I fail to see the proof of that. If by simply installing Vector and the PMDG NGX, which many pilots have, renders SIMstarter ineffective to live up to its claims, then what's the point?

[Tom A320 4915]

7 hours ago, Tony B. - CYVR said:

What I'd like to know is how is SIMstarter helping with OOMs if it can't do a thing about this common setup. In other words, what's the point of having SIMstarter if there is nothing it can do to prevent OOMs with a highly common setup as mine? 

 

SIMstarter claims to make it easy for you to use different configuration sets according your needs. These sets might be VAS and/or FPS optimized, or not. That is totally up to you. SIMstarter is just the tool to manage and run these different configuration sets.

 

With the tests you see now for yourself that there simply are configurations, that bring you easily into low memory situations. It is not the job of SIMstarter to fix that for you. That is something you have to do by yourself! SIMstarter is just a tool to make that as comfortable as possible.

 

To get an idea of what can do or not to prevent OOMs here is a good link to read:

• http://support.precisionmanuals.com/kb/a108/vas-management-stopping-out-of-memory-oom-errors.aspx

 

But again, SIMstarter does not claim to fix your OOM problems! It claims to help you getting them fixed once you know how to fix them. With the tests I had asked you to do, I wanted to put you on the right track for that.

 

7 hours ago, Tony B. - CYVR said:

renders SIMstarter ineffective to live up to its claims, then what's the point?

 

The point of SIMstarter is to manage different sets of configurations for your sim in a very easy and comfortable why. You may or may not use different configuration sets to optimise your memory usage within the sim. Others use them to differ between VFR and IFR flights with totally different scenery add-ons loaded, weather settings, visibility settings and even different hardware controller settings. That's what SIMstarter is about!

 

[FlyingAce63 1]

16 minutes ago, Tom A320 said:

With the tests you see now for yourself that there simply are configurations, that bring you easily into low memory situations. It is not the job of SIMstarter to fix that for you. That is something you have to do by yourself! SIMstarter is just a tool to make that as comfortable as possible.

 

Thanks for the explanation Tom. Just to be clear and to make sure I'm not misunderstanding you, by your comment above, you are saying that configurations such as mine that include NGX and Vector with an add-on scenery airport like FlyTampa Toronto will most likely bring on OOMs and there is nothing SIMstarter can do about it. In other words, If one wishes to fly a payware aircraft such as PMDG, one has to choose between using Vector and the default airport scenery. Or, the payware airport scenery without Vector. Or, one of the default aircrafts with both Vector and payware airport scenery, but not all three. Does that sound about right?

[Tom A320 4915]

I am not saying that you can't use all of that. If you encounter OOMs it is up to you to fine tune the P3D settings (terrain, scenery objects density, water, special effects, shadows, weather (cloud drawing distance), traffic).

 

There is no one rule how to configure a system that suits everyone and every system. This kind of fine tuning has to be done by you.

 

SIMstarter then helps to glue certain configurations into different sets and make is easy to switch between them. Like in VFR flying you have much higher detail settings and less demanding aircraft. In IFR you can lower the details as on cruise level you don't need any details at all anyway and give the NGX the space it needs.

[FlyingAce63 1]

4 minutes ago, Tom A320 said:

I am not saying that you can't use all of that. If you encounter OOMs it is up to you to fine tune the P3D settings (terrain, scenery objects density, water, special effects, shadows, weather (cloud drawing distance), traffic).

 

There is no one rule how to configure a system that suits everyone and every system. This kind of fine tuning has to be done by you.

 

SIMstarter then helps to glue certain configurations into different sets and make is easy to switch between them. Like in VFR flying you have much higher detail settings and less demanding aircraft. In IFR you can lower the details as on cruise level you don't need any details at all anyway and give the NGX the space it needs.

 

I see. May I ask if you use P3D and if you experience OOMs.

[Tom A320 4915]

I am on P3Dv3 and don't have problems with OOMs.

 

Have a look here:

 

 

[FlyingAce63 1]

7 hours ago, Tom A320 said:

I am on P3Dv3 and don't have problems with OOMs.

 

Have a look here:

 

 

 

Ok I don't get it. What am I missing? You have a lot more turned than I do and you're not getting OOMs. I'm using SIMstarter NG to deactivate all unnecessary scenery, plus I have a pc with higher performance specs than yours (see below) and I still can't fly from FlyTampa CYUL to FlyTampa CYYZ without an OOM crash while flying the STAR. As I begin to fly the STAR, FSUIPC's low VAS warning tone begins to sound. By the time I'm half way or two thirds of the way through the STAR, I get the dreaded crash and it's the end of my flight. IT IS SO INFURIATING! There has got to be more to this that I'm missing.

 

My pc specs:

• i7 4770K 3.5GHz, 4 cores (8 cores with HT)
• 16GB RAM
• Asus GeForce GTX 1070 OC with 8GB (factory overclocked)
• Samsung 850 Pro 500GB
• Windows 10 Pro
• P3D v3 (latest build)

My display settings:

Please login to display this image.

So, what am I doing wrong? Are there any settings you are adding to your cfg file that I need to add? By the way Tom, how do you measure the VAS usage as you overfly airports?

 

It really sucks that I can't complete a flight with only 2 airports loaded and others can with multiple airports and all the "nice-eye-candy" add-ons. I'm very perplexed and frustrated! HELP!!!

[FlyingAce63 1]

An update to this topic in case anyone is interested. The only way I was able to successfully fly from FlyTampa CYUL to FlyTampa CYYZ without any OOMs is by doing the following:

1. Turn off some of the options in the FlyTampa Configurator for both airports, such as Transparent Glass and interiors, 3D grass, Animated Cars and Apron Traffic etc. which is really sad because these are the things that make the sim look more realistic.
2. Deactivate FTX Global Airports and Orbx openLC Europe (since I was flying in North America)
3. Deactivate FTX Vector, which leads me to the question.... what's the point of buying it if I couldn't use it?
4. Have all other airport scenery, other than the two above, deactivated.

That said, I can't wait for a decent 64bit simulator. IF Xplane had more add-ons available, I'd switch in a heartbeat.