Deputy Sheriffs masterhawk 799 Posted June 5, 2016 Deputy Sheriffs Share Posted June 5, 2016 Some Information from LockheedMartin. If it will stay like this, I think we will have a lot problems with current/old sceneries, where the developers used old code. How is it with all the aerosoft sceneries? Beau Hollis wrote:Exact replication of the draw order generated by the legacy dx9 rendering system is not possible in the new system. We've done our best to fix specific issues as reported, but there will eventually be cases where fixing one add-on by modifying sort orders will break other add-ons. We posted a couple years back that we were dropping official support for the fs2002 routines for this vary reason, and encourage developers to stop using tools that rely on them. We made some major performance improvements in 3.2 which relied in part on changes to optimize some draw order sorting routines. These changes caused issues with a few add-ons which had worked in 3.1 and we addressed those issues in 3.3. We also fixed a bug in the sorting routine which made draw order non-deterministic in certain cases. We believe the sort is stable now and would prefer not to modify it again. Please keep reporting these issues, as we do appreciate the feedback, but also understand that we may not be able to investigate and respond. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guenseli 76 Posted June 5, 2016 Share Posted June 5, 2016 As Aerosoft was not able to fix the lights for the older airports now since some years or make any progress in AES for P3D I have really no hope at this point ... Seems we have to stick now with 3.2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lindbergh72 74 Posted June 5, 2016 Share Posted June 5, 2016 Yes... They NEED to stop using old dx9 rendering. Time to wake up and optimize the flightsim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mocchanyen 116 Posted June 5, 2016 Share Posted June 5, 2016 Prepar3D v3 uses DX11... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerosoft Aerosoft Team [Inactive Account] 51558 Posted June 6, 2016 Aerosoft Share Posted June 6, 2016 10 hours ago, lindbergh72 said: Yes... They NEED to stop using old dx9 rendering. Time to wake up and optimize the flightsim But as has been shown by many developers, the newer alternatives are not brilliant. We will look at this issue soon when the dust settles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guenseli 76 Posted June 6, 2016 Share Posted June 6, 2016 Thanks for answering, Mathijs! Hope this time Aerosoft will really update the old sceneries like German Airports etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cargostorm 98 Posted June 6, 2016 Share Posted June 6, 2016 vor 58 Minuten, Nuno Pinto sagte: Just give the developers some time to adjust and meanwhile use 3.2 if your airport is currently "broken". LM stated that the loss of compatibility is "by design". I doubt you can expect a hotfix or a compatibility update, but you have to accept that the old (FSX) airports that are based on old technology will no longer work. On the other hand, it will take very long time until a developer has made their airports P3D-compatible (if at all). Most of the FSX airports will never experience a P3D update. As a result, it must be accepted that the majority of the airports that are based on FSX technology will no longer work in version 3.3. As a consequence, I will stick to v3.2 for the moment. Imagine what will happen when LM jumps on 64 bit (maybe end of this or next year) - all airports will be broken and eventually you need to re-buy them again... And this within a rather short period of time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delphi 24 Posted June 6, 2016 Share Posted June 6, 2016 Aerosoft claimed for many airports that they are P3D V3 compatible. This expressly warranted property is not given for some sceneries which I had bought based on that claim. It gets obviously that this is not the case because of non-compliance with the P3D V3 SDK. This is a product defect and the seller (Aerosoft) is obliged to remedy this defect. If not, Aerosoft might get into the situation to pay the money back to dissatisfied customer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerosoft Aerosoft Team [Inactive Account] 51558 Posted June 6, 2016 Aerosoft Share Posted June 6, 2016 40 minutes ago, Delphi said: Aerosoft claimed for many airports that they are P3D V3 compatible. This expressly warranted property is not given for some sceneries which I had bought based on that claim. It gets obviously that this is not the case because of non-compliance with the P3D V3 SDK. This is a product defect and the seller (Aerosoft) is obliged to remedy this defect. If not, Aerosoft might get into the situation to pay the money back to dissatisfied customer. My my... such big words. The scenery you bought before last Friday was bought as fully compatible at the time you bought it. If you buy it now it is indeed and issue for some products and some customers. That's why we change the product pages. We'll start editing product pages before working on products. What is clear however is that P3D will be a less attractive platform for many developers. Making these updates on an existing product could easily eat up the profit on a product. And you run the same risk in three months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delphi 24 Posted June 6, 2016 Share Posted June 6, 2016 If you has seller claim P3D V3 compatibility for a product than it becomes a expressly warranted property. Not more not less. If you are not sure about or if you think that relevant legislation and regulations do not apply to products you sell, ask your lawyer. Ruediger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerosoft Aerosoft Team [Inactive Account] 51558 Posted June 6, 2016 Aerosoft Share Posted June 6, 2016 We did. We do not have to guarantee it will work for any possible new version of the required software. If Microsoft changes Windows so it will no longer run any add-ons for any version of FS we are not required to refund all products we sold the last 25 years. We also do not have to refund products sold as Prepar3D compatible when Prepar3D V2 was released. But I am not sure why you are going this way, why not sit back, have a coffee and see what happens. If you want to sue us desperately before we even have decided how to handle this feel free. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delphi 24 Posted June 6, 2016 Share Posted June 6, 2016 If you claim compatibility with P3D V3 means that the product was developed according to the P3D V3 SDK specification. This seems obviously not the case. I talk only about products which you are promoting as P3D V3 compatible, not about any legacy products. However, I will sit back and have a coffee or two and see what happens. Ruediger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emi 5161 Posted June 6, 2016 Share Posted June 6, 2016 Compability means that the product as it is provided works as it should in the version of the simulator current at the time of release. Nothing else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fabian Boulegue 403 Posted June 6, 2016 Share Posted June 6, 2016 Sir, the product been compatible at the date you bought it, with the current P3D Version, there are no Information about any SDK or something. If you bought a V3 Product since the release of P3D V3.3 and this does not work, we are more then happy to find a solution for you, but only if you bought it after the release of V3.3 with the Product Information say P3DV3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerosoft Aerosoft Team [Inactive Account] 51558 Posted June 6, 2016 Aerosoft Share Posted June 6, 2016 2 minutes ago, Delphi said: If you claim compatibility with P3D V3 means that the product was developed according to the P3D V3 SDK specification. This seems obviously not the case. I talk only about products which you are promoting as P3D V3 compatible, not about any legacy products. However, I will sit back and have a coffee or two and see what happens. Ruediger Well, if the SDK is the deciding factor there are very very few real P3D products. In every high end aircraft we do things that go way beyond the SDK to get where we need to go. In scenery as well. Things like SODE are not in the SDK right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Egbert Drenth 52 Posted June 6, 2016 Share Posted June 6, 2016 46 minutes ago, Delphi said: If you claim compatibility with P3D V3 means that the product was developed according to the P3D V3 SDK specification. This seems obviously not the case. Ruediger Geeeez man. Take a chill pill.... For ages developers work around the constraints of FS6, FS98, FS2000, ..... P3D1, P3D2, P3D3, ..... Without those we wouldn't have PMDG, Majestic, Aerosoft, FlyTampa,... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Querer 74 Posted June 6, 2016 Share Posted June 6, 2016 42 minutes ago, Fabian Boulegue said: If you bought a V3 Product since the release of P3D V3.3 and this does not work, we are more then happy to find a solution for you, but only if you bought it after the release of V3.3 with the Product Information say P3DV3. You are aware of the fact that Prepar3d v3.3 is still Prepar3d v3 as written in the product information? Just imagine Adobe (or any other Developer) telling their customers after a Windows 10 update: "we are sorry, but your Photoshop version is only working in exactly this Windows 10 version which was available at the time you purchased our product". Ridiculous... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fabian Boulegue 403 Posted June 6, 2016 Share Posted June 6, 2016 Sir thats why we change our product page to V3.2 and all orders that been done in the time of release of 3.3 and the change can be refunded. If you bought it before you bought it for the "current version" there was never claimed that it will work with future updates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guenseli 76 Posted June 6, 2016 Share Posted June 6, 2016 vor 7 Minuten, Fabian Boulegue sagte: Sir thats why we change our product page to V3.2 and all orders that been done in the time of release of 3.3 and the change can be refunded. If you bought it before you bought it for the "current version" there was never claimed that it will work with future updates. Interesting solution Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deputy Sheriffs Tom A320 4915 Posted June 6, 2016 Deputy Sheriffs Share Posted June 6, 2016 1 minute ago, guenseli said: Interesting solution This is of course the short term solution. Please do not ignore the original answer in this topic: 4 hours ago, Mathijs Kok said: We will look at this issue soon when the dust settles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fabian Boulegue 403 Posted June 6, 2016 Share Posted June 6, 2016 3 minutes ago, guenseli said: Interesting solution This is the only solution we can offer for now - as we dont have any eta for updates. So if you bought it after the 3.3 release and thought it should work (and the product page sad it should work in P3D v3), feel free to get in touch. We currently try to figure out what does work and what does not work and where we/developer can start look to work on different stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Querer 74 Posted June 6, 2016 Share Posted June 6, 2016 30 minutes ago, Fabian Boulegue said: Sir thats why we change our product page to V3.2 and all orders that been done in the time of release of 3.3 and the change can be refunded. If you bought it before you bought it for the "current version" there was never claimed that it will work with future updates. Yes, but it does not say like this in my product description at the time I bought my addon. If you state Prepar3d v3, this includes 3.1, 3.2, 3.3 and up to 3.9, if you like it or not, as ALL those subversions are included in a statement like "compatible to Prepar3d v3". It would be different, if you would have written "compatible to Prepar3d v3.0", but you did not. Simple as that. But anyway, as Tom said, we should not forget the original answer in this topic. And: we should also not forget that many sceneries from AS DO work without any issues in v3.3, such as EDDF v2 and Zurich v2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cargostorm 98 Posted June 6, 2016 Share Posted June 6, 2016 Is there a chance that you, Aerosoft, speak with LM to see if there is a common way to revert the compatibility issues introduced in v3.3. by an update? If it was an intended decision by LM, I know it is difficult. I assume they carefully evaluated and finally accepted the consequences such a step may cause. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fabian Boulegue 403 Posted June 6, 2016 Share Posted June 6, 2016 1 minute ago, Querer said: Yes, but it does not say like this in my product description at the time I bought my addon. If you state Prepar3d v3, this includes 3.1, 3.2, 3.3 and up to 3.9, if you like it or not, as ALL those subversions are included in a statement like "compatible to Prepar3d v3". It would be different, if you would have written "compatible to Prepar3d v3.0", but you did not. Simple as that. But anyway, as Tom said, we should not forget the original answer in this topic. And: we should also not forget that many sceneries from AS DO work without any issues in v3.3, such as EDDF v2 and Zurich v2. We have no idea how P3D call there simulators - they could also call this 4.0 or P3D without any numbers, the scenery / addon did work with the "date of purchased released information" and never be claimed to be compatible with any future updates. As we sad we looking into updates but some might take longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ageva 69 Posted June 6, 2016 Share Posted June 6, 2016 43 minutes ago, Querer said: You are aware of the fact that Prepar3d v3.3 is still Prepar3d v3 as written in the product information? Just imagine Adobe (or any other Developer) telling their customers after a Windows 10 update: "we are sorry, but your Photoshop version is only working in exactly this Windows 10 version which was available at the time you purchased our product". Ridiculous... So if LM would call it v4.0 you won't have a problem to accept the incompatibility? Amos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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